noddyc Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 I had a bigger prop once, slipped on takeoff and broke it, this one I have not yet manage to brake, even with a few crash landings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cas_whitmore Posted March 19, 2020 Share Posted March 19, 2020 Shame there heavy, do look pretty though . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B1078 Posted July 4, 2020 Share Posted July 4, 2020 Hi, 'Paranoob' on youtube has a 242cc EOS preproduction model to test! https://youtu.be/3-BSojWMSAc Greetings, Tim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi k Posted July 5, 2020 Share Posted July 5, 2020 On 04/07/2020 at 11:35, B1078 said: Hi, 'Paranoob' on youtube has a 242cc EOS preproduction model to test! https://youtu.be/3-BSojWMSAc Greetings, Tim Tim Paul messaged me earlier to see if i was going to be at one of our flying club locations during this week as he will be there with said engine , but big possibility the day he has chosen is no good for me , current suggested thrust figures and fuel consumption with overall engine weight make it a game changer . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B1078 Posted July 5, 2020 Share Posted July 5, 2020 3 hours ago, kiwi k said: Tim Paul messaged me earlier to see if i was going to be at one of our flying club locations during this week as he will be there with said engine , but big possibility the day he has chosen is no good for me , current suggested thrust figures and fuel consumption with overall engine weight make it a game changer . I'm looking forward to reviews and pricing (also parts. Almost bougth the V5 currently for sale here on the forum, but spare parts pricing and availability put me off at the last moment.) Greetings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 5, 2020 Share Posted July 5, 2020 6 hours ago, kiwi k said: Tim Paul messaged me earlier to see if i was going to be at one of our flying club locations during this week as he will be there with said engine , but big possibility the day he has chosen is no good for me , current suggested thrust figures and fuel consumption with overall engine weight make it a game changer . Hi, im just curious what gap they are trying to fill with this engine? They are obviously not trying to save weight as that will never happen with a 4t. Noise? Not sure they will be able to make it much quieter than others. Power? Its not going to trump a 2t is it? Fuel consumption it would win hands down over the 2t`s but as with anything this usually comes at a cost eg weight. It would be awesome if it ticked any of the boxes , i was just wondering what the goal was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
admin (Simon W) Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 On 21/08/2017 at 06:26, noddyc said: Hi Andy Have a look at this youtube video I am thinking of getting myself an paracell kit to fit to my existing chassis , keep us updated I am quite interested in it . Casey Casey, We became dealers for the Paracell a year ago We are just about to order a couple for a TV show I am working on in the future. SW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrsfrwll Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 42 minutes ago, admin (Simon W) said: Casey, We became dealers for the Paracell a year ago We are just about to order a couple for a TV show I am working on in the future. SW Kept that quiet Looks a very interesting piece of kit. Any details on price of unit, price of separate batteries, recharge times, and effect of cold on flight times for winter flying (well, autumn and spring too, lol). 70 minutes beats OpenPPG hands down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi k Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 14 hours ago, toploader said: Hi, im just curious what gap they are trying to fill with this engine? They are obviously not trying to save weight (sorry but figures on this engine state it is only fractionally heavier than a Moster) as that will never happen with a 4t (Originally true but not in todays engineering world). Noise?(4 strokes have always been quieter ) Not sure they will be able to make it much quieter than others. Power? Its not going to trump a 2t is it?(i would of said not, but two friends who own Moster's have said it feels it has more Ooomph) Fuel consumption it would win hands down over the 2t`s but as with anything this usually comes at a cost eg weight. It would be awesome if it ticked any of the boxes , i was just wondering what the goal was. I fly a Moster but XC's is were i am looking to go so this engine if reliable and puts out anywhere near the expected figures, will be my hands down choice and yes i know the wing choice also comes into the equation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 4 minutes ago, kiwi k said: I fly a Moster but XC's is were i am looking to go so this engine if reliable and puts out anywhere near the expected figures, will be my hands down choice and yes i know the wing choice also comes into the equation Yes i think it would probably be a good choice for XC if only because of the fuel consumption. I would be really surprised if it gets anywhere near the weight of a 2t to be honest, just the fact there are so many more parts inside. And yes 4t are quiet but only with heavy power sapping exhaust systems not like the one ive seen on this. But i will be very interested to see/hear the final version . Ive been involved with 4t engine development for quite a few years in off road bikes and yes they have come a long way. It is however very interesting that so many have now returned to 2t! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi k Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 Latest update from this year including https://www.scoutparamotor.com/update-best-paramotor-engine-ever-4stroke-news/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
noddyc Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 11 hours ago, admin (Simon W) said: On 21/08/2017 at 06:26, noddyc said: ite interested in it . Casey Casey, We became dealers for the Paracell a year ago We are just about to order a couple for a TV show I am working on in the future. SW Simon, send me details Casey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B1078 Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 23 hours ago, toploader said: Hi, im just curious what gap they are trying to fill with this engine? They are obviously not trying to save weight as that will never happen with a 4t. Noise? Not sure they will be able to make it much quieter than others. Power? Its not going to trump a 2t is it? Fuel consumption it would win hands down over the 2t`s but as with anything this usually comes at a cost eg weight. It would be awesome if it ticked any of the boxes , i was just wondering what the goal was. For me it would be, reliability and longevity, fuel consumption, smooth power delivery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 22 minutes ago, B1078 said: For me it would be, reliability and longevity, fuel consumption, smooth power delivery. Yeah all things we all want. Which one of them are you not getting at the moment? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 6, 2020 Share Posted July 6, 2020 25 minutes ago, B1078 said: For me it would be, reliability and longevity, fuel consumption, smooth power delivery. After spending years developing competition motorcycle engines we found that the only thing the 4t was better at than the 2t was fuel economy. Actually there was one other thing and that was grip. The way the 4t made its power was better for grip on an off road bike but as the years have gone by the 2t have caught back up. Interestingly 4t engines made the off road sport much more expensive. They need regular rebuilds and when one of them fails its really messy. Things have also changed in the last few years with the economy side too. Evinrude now make a 2t engine which is lighter, more powerful. has lower emissions and has longer service intervals than its equivalent 4t. The key is fuel injection. But with injection comes more electrics, more money and more weight so not sure this is the right way to go for paramotors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B1078 Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 (edited) 12 hours ago, toploader said: Yeah all things we all want. Which one of them are you not getting at the moment? 2stroke in combination with them silly walbro pumpercarbs is giving me zero reliability and terrible longevity. And how many pistons have been melted due to small problems with them. I'm going to mill an adapter plate and fit a pwk28 in an attempt to not have the constant feeling in flight that something is wrong. Your statements about 2 vs 4stroke are probably correct if you talk about highly stressed, high horsepower applications. A 4stroke that's not pushed to the limit will last 'for ever', as long the oil lubrication doesn't fail. Edited July 7, 2020 by B1078 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackburn Mark Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 9 hours ago, toploader said: Interestingly 4t engines made the off road sport much more expensive. The early Bailey motors are a much more generic version of the GY6 motor so parts for those are very cheap. The latter V5 versions and the EOS are based upon a Taiwanese aftermarket GY6 upgrade kit (67mm piston//stroker crank//decompression cam).... quite pricey. 27hp on the EOS has me thinking the cylinder and piston are going to have a harder life than any of the Baileys so assuming reliability might not be sound. Some more power and less weight would be very nice but the 2.2 liters/hour and cheap parts has me trapped lugging 40kg+..... nice once you are off the floor though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 24 minutes ago, B1078 said: 2stroke in combination with them silly walbro pumpercarbs is giving me zero reliability and terrible longevity. And how many pistons have been melted by small problems with them. I'm going to mill an adapter plate and fit a pwk28 in an attempt to not have the constant feeling in flight that something is wrong. Your statements about 2 vs 4stroke are probably right if you talk about highly stressed, high horsepower applications. A 4stroke that's not pushed to the limit will last 'for ever', as long the oil lubrication doesn't fail. Yes the oil is a major problem on the bike engines because it carries all the debris from the clutch and gearbox which luckily you don't have on a paramotor engine. I'm with you on the carb issue too. Can't understand why the carb they still use on the latest moster is so sensitive. They must be able to sort it out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob27 Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 From my experience with 2 and 4 stroke motorcycles and other engines these are the rough and speculative advantages and disadvantages of the eos 4 stroke. Advantages: Quieter, more more fuel efficient, less vibration, no spark plug fouling, no oil mixing, wide power band, no explanation chamber. Disadvantages: Complex valve train that is maintenance intensive, very frequent oil and oil filter changes, top end rebuild intervals likely every 75 to 125 hours, lots more parts that can fail, will likely cost a lot more than a 2 stroke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrsfrwll Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 12 hours ago, Bob27 said: From my experience with 2 and 4 stroke motorcycles and other engines these are the rough and speculative advantages and disadvantages of the eos 4 stroke. Advantages: Quieter, more more fuel efficient, less vibration, no spark plug fouling, no oil mixing, wide power band, no explanation chamber. I've got all of that from my Atom 80 running Aspen fuel, plus it weighs a lot less. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackburn Mark Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 I often hear of people getting excellent efficiency from two strokes.... I have yet to witness it in practice. From my limited experience (don't often fly with others) I seem to have a bit less than twice the range on a full tank. That makes up for all its downsides, it has a few Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hann__ Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 What would you call excellent 2T efficiency, Mark? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackburn Mark Posted September 18, 2020 Share Posted September 18, 2020 2.5 lph Average on an xc flight would start getting close enough to making the difference negligible. I can fly four hours and land with a reasonable reserve (10l tank)... I have calculated approx. 2.2 lph (trimmers in on a 23m kougar) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hann__ Posted September 19, 2020 Share Posted September 19, 2020 Yep, that`s excellent alright, i don`t think many 2T`s would be able to get near that! Must be a great feeling flying with a motor that sips fuel so sparingly, cheap too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrsfrwll Posted September 19, 2020 Share Posted September 19, 2020 8 hours ago, Blackburn Mark said: 2.5 lph Average on an xc flight would start getting close enough to making the difference negligible. I can fly four hours and land with a reasonable reserve (10l tank)... I have calculated approx. 2.2 lph (trimmers in on a 23m kougar) That is pretty phenomenal and no, I don't come close. However at 3l/hr I'm happy with the trade in simplicity and lightness, noting I have the other advantages. One downside I'll have to concede is flight running cost/hr. 2.2ltr/hr @ £1.10/ltr vs 3ltr/hr @ £4.00/ltr could soon sway the balance. Aspen isn't cheap! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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