Curiosity Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 (edited) Complete newbie question, but........ I understand the importance of keeping ones eyes peeled for other aircraft, but at the same time (given the slow speed of paramotors and the far greater speed of pretty much everything else) isn't this a little like asking a hedgehog to keep a good lookout when crossing the M4? Is avoidance really an option, or is it more a question of making sure you present a more visible aspect of your wing to oncoming traffic? I.e. hedgehog in hi-vis vest with strobe on its head. Edited November 21, 2012 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richwill15 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Fast jets won't see you. They see very little other traffic. But most everything else will get a chance to avoid. Unless you're already in close vicinity (such as in the circuit) and it'll be you trying to avoid the balloons Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curiosity Posted November 21, 2012 Author Share Posted November 21, 2012 Those damed balloons must sneak up on you pretty fast I imagine. I suppose the other factor, that I hadn't appreciated is that the slow speed of a paramotor also helps to reduce the closing speed compared to a couple of Group A aircraft meeting head on. So, if fast jets don't see paramotors, what do they see? I naively imagined that paramotors were at least as visible as anything else (except balloons), if not more so. Looks like a hi-vis vest could be a plan! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgy Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 When you do get in the air... Make sure you keep an eye on your flying buddy as they disappear very quickly into the back ground. A paramotor can be almost impossible to see sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_b Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 When you do get in the air... Make sure you keep an eye on your flying buddy as they disappear very quickly into the back ground. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bholleran Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 It makes no difference if you are flying with Mark, if he loses sight of you it is Top Gear rules, and so leaves you any way The worst case for me is flying straight into the sun, a really good pair of shades halps, but even then you can know that someone is in front of you and totally loose them. Could be a disaster if you did not know they were there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richwill15 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 [*] So, if fast jets don't see paramotors, what do they see? I naively imagined that paramotors were at least as visible as anything else (except balloons), if not more so. Looks like a hi-vis vest could be a plan! When they're low? Closing speeds are fast. Very little collision avoidance. Which is why you gotta stay clear of the low level routes particularly during the week. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curiosity Posted November 21, 2012 Author Share Posted November 21, 2012 I'm still at the ground handling stage. Is that low enough to avoid the fast jets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_k Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 You might think so but we had one come over the top of the house a few years back that was so low it made us duck We often get a twin prop military one that flies at 200 feet, but he's quite slow Cheers, Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgy Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Barry Top gear rules only apply if you crash... Like Luke on the Isle of wight . Or if you have an engine out and nothing can be done... We always make sure the downed pilot gets home... As you well know from Experiance when you used to Own the worlds most unreliable Paramotor. Glad things have now changed for the better!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richwill15 Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 I'm still at the ground handling stage. Is that low enough to avoid the fast jets? if you're in a low level corridor? no Minimums is normally 100' but they're cleared to go >0 <250 higher than 250' and they're not doing a good job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curiosity Posted November 21, 2012 Author Share Posted November 21, 2012 Happily very little low flying fast stuff around here, but I'll keep an eye out when the moment comes. Hi-vis bobble hat and kevlar Y-fronts at the ready. Gift-wrapping a Tornado would be an exciting, but brief adventure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dantheman Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Happily very little low flying fast stuff around here, but I'll keep an eye out when the moment comes. Hi-vis bobble hat and kevlar Y-fronts at the ready. Gift-wrapping a Tornado would be an exciting, but brief adventure. This is the cannon mount from a Tornado that ended up in the field next to our house (up north), 50ft is the norm on the ranges but unfortunately this one clipped trees on a slight hill and ploughed in, we could do nothing for the crew. I'm a bit of a stickler for checking NOTAMS and low flying danger area activations etc. Full story HERE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ppgnovice Posted November 21, 2012 Share Posted November 21, 2012 Thankfully our nation now has no enemies and we can afford huge cuts in our defence budget meaning that low flying jets will soon be a rare sight! Must be part of a very cunning plan which includes releasing terrorists while imprisoning the SAS! .....I digress from lookout.... 7 nm a minute for a fast jet, just hope the pilot doesn't drop his pen! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curiosity Posted November 22, 2012 Author Share Posted November 22, 2012 A sad tale about the Tornado. Rather puts my off my plan to go for a low-level potter around 'The Loop' in Wales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richwill15 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 The loop is fun. Rarely used at wknds. You can always call up and ask. But the mountains produce all sorts of gusts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curiosity Posted November 22, 2012 Author Share Posted November 22, 2012 I was actually joking about the loop, but it does sound quite fun. Not including the gusts/rotor! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richwill15 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 ahhh! G'wan!! you know you wanna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curiosity Posted November 22, 2012 Author Share Posted November 22, 2012 (edited) I want to, I want to, I admit it, ......... But Simon might possibly suggest I get my first flight under my belt before I actually set off to Wales. Or is that just me being a bit of a wimp? Edited November 22, 2012 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richwill15 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 i reckon you want to get your first year under your belt before you try that one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curiosity Posted November 22, 2012 Author Share Posted November 22, 2012 Spoilsport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richwill15 Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonP Posted November 22, 2012 Share Posted November 22, 2012 true about the inevitable reduction in fast jets but as compensation looks like the MOD is committed to its Drone program, not sure how I feel about flying around having to be spotted by a Xbox player miles away in RAF Waddington getting to grips with his new Reaper drone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Posted November 24, 2012 Share Posted November 24, 2012 true about the inevitable reduction in fast jets but as compensation looks like the MOD is committed to its Drone program, not sure how I feel about flying around having to be spotted by a Xbox player miles away in RAF Waddington getting to grips with his new Reaper drone! I was tracked by a military drone a couple of months ago. I only found out a couple of days later when a friend in the military told me they had been tracking me from the back of a Transit whilst testing the drones prior to deployment. The drone's camera showed I was wearing the latest DPM camo trousers and their first thought was whether something was going on that they should know about. I checked the helmet cam footage but the drone was too small and far away to be visible (but I did manage to spot their Transit eventually ). I find the threat from drones pales compared to the low level jets, Hercules and Chinooks I have to avoid around here. I do NOTAMS every time - except last week when I managed to get an unexpected flight in and just as I was about to clip in a jet came over at a couple of hundred feet at lower than usual speed. It's likely the pilot saw the wing laid out because his mates came past a couple of minutes later and had made a clear point of avoiding my position by about three miles whereas they normally fly in fairly predictable position in this spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaggydec Posted November 27, 2012 Share Posted November 27, 2012 (edited) Well the fast jets , and Hercs , and Helicopters , have all seen me ( so far ! ).... I try to stay away from known flightpaths through the week . I ve been in the same airspace as F-15 s , Toccano s, Hawks( 3 flew under me in formation ) , Hercules , and Typhoons . Where i live , anything can appear at anytime , so i tend to fly low near the beaches and sea , or close to the mountains . Weekends are generally quiet , just the odd private plane or helicopter...... Edited November 27, 2012 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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