dede2008 Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 We had a case where one pilot got into the power lines and luckily got out unscathed but had caused a major black out to the nearby city. And this was a "PROPERLY" trained pilot Where did he train then. Pete PS independent instructors and pilots can get insurance. Yes, he was a properly trained pilot who was unlucky enough to get a wing collapse ending up there. Never judge by the book. I assume by your tone that you think this will never happen to you since you probably consider yourself "an expert". Well I wouldn't be so confident if I were you The point is another anyway, you *CAN* get insurance is different that you *MUST*. If I were flying in UK I wished everyone around me had one so in the event some idiot hit me and do some damage at least I am covered. It could possibly happen to me but as I know how to check the weather correctly and fly in the right weather conditions and fly within my capabilities then it is very very unlikely to happen as wings do not collapse unless some thing causes it. I am not an expert by all means but stopped counting the hours Ive flown at 600 and that was a few years ago. I have flown in many different countries in varying conditions so I do know what I am talking about. I am insured and always have been, if you got hit by someone with no insurance then Im sure your phone will melt with the no win no fee lawyers that promise you thousands and thousands of pounds compensation. And as a famous russion would say "Have nice day" The wing collapsed due to a sudden, unpredictable change of conditions. If you have flown enough you should know that such an event can happen and is not that rare. Meteorology is far from a perfect science As for insurance, sure my phone will ring, problem is if the guy is a DIY cheapo-hippie-I-dont-own-a-thing-in-the-world I will not get a dime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 The last accident I know of locally was a broken bone at Milk Hill about 4 weeks ago. Not sure who the instructor was (although I have an idea) but he was in the BHPA but was NOT a member of the local club the TVHGPC....(so did not have site guide I assume? ) And I suppose technically no insurance for the same reason??? We dont let non members fly at our field for the same reason, in fact the last person who landed without permission was also a BHPA instructor and he landed on the closed runway of an active (GA) airfield! lol (of course all of my day one students knew this!) You can put as many letters before and after your name as you like, accidents are accidents f ups are f ups and they happen, with no 'intent' to harm. If you don't want to risk getting hurt in your life, stay in bed. SW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Staying in bed is not 'qualified' advice it may harm you, seek a doctors advice before staying in bed. SW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_b Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Staying in bed is not 'qualified' advice it may harm you, seek a doctors advice before staying in bed. SW I know someone that was fully experienced in lying in bed all day as he was a lazy git and!!! Well thats another story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spigot Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Dede2008 wrote: The wing collapsed due to a sudden, unpredictable change of conditions. If you have flown enough you should know that such an event can happen and is not that rare. Meteorology is far from a perfect science. Something ain't right here. Now I cant tell you what the weather will be like next week. But I can tell when I turn up at the field, what to expect for the next few hours in the locations I plan to fly to / from. What I can also predict. Either takeoff, en route or landing are the effects of rotor / thermal triggers / mates prop wash. And can fly to avoid or expect them and deal with it. Changing conditions I except. Sudden and unpredictable.....is something I'm not familiar with. So this guy is flying as an experienced "qualified pilot" flying either alongside and low level or above a set of HT power lines..........!!! I'm pretty sure the UK insurance providers would love that one "Void" Colin the Hippie B Did someone have a dig a hippies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Staying in bed is not 'qualified' advice it may harm you, seek a doctors advice before staying in bed. SW I know someone that was fully experienced in lying in bed all day as he was a lazy git and!!! Well thats another story. You BAD BAD man!!! lol SW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Dede2008 wrote:The wing collapsed due to a sudden, unpredictable change of conditions. If you have flown enough you should know that such an event can happen and is not that rare. Meteorology is far from a perfect science. Something ain't right here. Now I cant tell you what the weather will be like next week. But I can tell when I turn up at the field, what to expect for the next few hours in the locations I plan to fly to / from. What I can also predict. Either takeoff, en route or landing are the effects of rotor / thermal triggers / mates prop wash. And can fly to avoid or expect them and deal with it. Changing conditions I except. Sudden and unpredictable.....is something I'm not familiar with. So this guy is flying as an experienced "qualified pilot" flying either alongside and low level or above a set of HT power lines..........!!! I'm pretty sure the UK insurance providers would love that one "Void" Colin the Hippie B Did someone have a dig a hippies What he said! And the hippy dissing bit! SW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outkast Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 I dont think there is any right or wrong answer to the question of wether to take a training course, or to learn alongside other more experienced pilots. all individuals are just that "individual" we are all different and pick up different skills at different rates, some of us can take to the practical side of flying very quickly, but may struggle with the stuff like navigatin, air law etc. I think people fall mostly into two groups when they start out in this sport/pastime whatever you want to call it. first there are those who just want to fly, get up in the air and just enjoy it. Then there are those want to embrace all it has to offer, pushing themselves to accomplish more all the time. wich of the two above you fall into depends greatly on what type of character you are, it also gives a fair indication as to wether a paid up training program may be for you, or learning alongside others would be a better route. sure we may learn better when we are given a structered framework to follow, but that is not exclusive. What we enjoy most about this sport is freedom and that same freedom means we also have a choice how we go about acheiving our goals. Just as making the right wing/motor choice is important so is the route you take and only you can decide on that. I think most people with a bit of common sense can learn to fly a paramotor, but flying one of thses things is just part of the big picture, becoming a pilot takes another set of skills, understanding air law, navigation, meteorology, dynamics of flight etc. learning to fly and learning to be a pilot are different things. just my 2 cents worth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 And what he said! With the addition, becoming a 'pilot' takes time and is a personal 'attitude' SW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spigot Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Well said Dave... Nicely back on thread Do you want a cuddle now? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outkast Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 and dont diss the hippies man, like you know with all this bad vibe and stuff, I really dont want to be on a downer man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 and dont diss the hippies man, like you know with all this bad vibe and stuff, I really dont want to be on a downer man LOL There are too many 'cosmic rays' bouncing around in here... I am off to bed. I cant wait to see what the morning will bring with you pair! LOL SW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outkast Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 Well said Dave... Nicely back on thread Do you want a cuddle now? can I bring my sock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_b Posted August 27, 2012 Share Posted August 27, 2012 and dont diss the hippies man, like you know with all this bad vibe and stuff, I really dont want to be on a downer man what he said man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dede2008 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Dede2008 wrote:The wing collapsed due to a sudden, unpredictable change of conditions. If you have flown enough you should know that such an event can happen and is not that rare. Meteorology is far from a perfect science. Something ain't right here. Now I cant tell you what the weather will be like next week. But I can tell when I turn up at the field, what to expect for the next few hours in the locations I plan to fly to / from. What I can also predict. Either takeoff, en route or landing are the effects of rotor / thermal triggers / mates prop wash. And can fly to avoid or expect them and deal with it. Changing conditions I except. Sudden and unpredictable.....is something I'm not familiar with. So this guy is flying as an experienced "qualified pilot" flying either alongside and low level or above a set of HT power lines..........!!! I'm pretty sure the UK insurance providers would love that one "Void" Colin the Hippie B Did someone have a dig a hippies You are probably right, you haven't flown enough hours to be familiar and experience a sudden and unpredictable change of conditions. It takes a lot of flying time to realize the weather is not always as predictable as it was on the paper. I have just passed the 500 hours mark in the last three years only (yea, good weather and lots of free time), and it happened twice (luckily without consequences). As for hippies, that was a joke to make a point guys, has the british humor gone to the bin with recession? Anyway, I feel I made my point here so I do apologize to the OP for the initial rant and thread hijacking (no apologies for racist and unnecessary offenses though). We obviously come from a different background as I assumed UK regulations were no different than italy, france, spain or most of the other countries - my fault, really, I should have known, you drive on the wrong side of the road, have a different distance, weight, currency system I still prefer our system, but its good to know how it works over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spigot Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Dede Your probably right. I really should try and get some more time in By the way well done on averaging 166 hours per year. My first year back in 2008 I managed 96 hours which was flying every day/evening it was flyable in the southern UK I stopped counting after that. And only having 2 collapses in 500 hours is quite extraordinary (non events when your high enough and experienced enough to expect such ) Which still begs the question why did the guy end up in the power lines? Perhaps I should get my butt over there for some master classes. So I can see a bit of Sudden and Unpredictable weather as I'm pretty sure we don't have any here. Cheers for now. I'm off to swot up for my PPL meteorology exam. .. oh no wait.. passed them already And my tongue really is bleeding quite heavily now. Colin B (RAF) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dede2008 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Colin, by sudden and unpredictable conditions I don't mean you go out in the sky on a sunny blue day and in 2 minutes it covers up and a storm starts without you even noticing it. I am mainly referring to wind conditions. The wind can pick up sometimes, we all know that. What I was not prepared for in two different occasions was encountering the most bizarre wind currents I have ever met in a clear blue sky and in the same place I have flown hundred of times with no signs of instability in the synoptic chart or anything unusual. It was for both cases more or less like being in a laundry machine, for example the first one: no wind at takeoff and for two kms, then a strong east wind which dragged me for 1 km sideways only to deposit me right in the middle of the cross with a west current blowing even stronger. All in 5 squared km, and no mountains around to justify some sort of rotors or currents. It was not the only collapses I had in 500 hours, just the strangest and scariest ones. We normally have 5 flyable days each week, winters are pretty dry and sunny and one of the takeoffs I use is behind my house, so its easy to spend time in the air. In summertime I even use the paramotor to go to and come back from work! Now how cool is that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alan_k Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Now that IS cool Cheers, Alan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_b Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Colin,by sudden and unpredictable conditions I don't mean you go out in the sky on a sunny blue day and in 2 minutes it covers up and a storm starts without you even noticing it. I am mainly referring to wind conditions. The wind can pick up sometimes, we all know that. What I was not prepared for in two different occasions was encountering the most bizarre wind currents I have ever met in a clear blue sky and in the same place I have flown hundred of times with no signs of instability in the synoptic chart or anything unusual. It was for both cases more or less like being in a laundry machine, for example the first one: no wind at takeoff and for two kms, then a strong east wind which dragged me for 1 km sideways only to deposit me right in the middle of the cross with a west current blowing even stronger. All in 5 squared km, and no mountains around to justify some sort of rotors or currents. It was not the only collapses I had in 500 hours, just the strangest and scariest ones. We normally have 5 flyable days each week, winters are pretty dry and sunny and one of the takeoffs I use is behind my house, so its easy to spend time in the air. In summertime I even use the paramotor to go to and come back from work! Now how cool is that? Send us a google link to where this happened please, You have me intrigued now Time of year and time of day would be nice aswel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dede2008 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Around this area: http://goo.gl/maps/qkHvo It happened both times in june (some 20 days apart), both on a late afternoon flight, I'd say 7 P.M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outkast Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Around this area:http://goo.gl/maps/qkHvo It happened both times in june (some 20 days apart), both on a late afternoon flight, I'd say 7 P.M. do you have any weather patterns that are particular to the area? like the mistral in some parts of france? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neilzy Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Iv'e traveled to Italy a few times over the past couple of years had to visit some over priced Kit Car manufacturer down in Marrinello i have to say i was so suprised that said manufacturer was always late a behind in what ever they do for me, normally due to them being the most disorganised bunch of irate inderviduals ive ever met. Im not suprised they have such a high accident rate as they obviously struggle to follow any kind of stuctured process....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dede2008 Posted August 28, 2012 Share Posted August 28, 2012 Iv'e traveled to Italy a few times over the past couple of years had to visit some over priced Kit Car manufacturer down in Marrinello i have to say i was so suprised that said manufacturer was always late a behind in what ever they do for me, normally due to them being the most disorganised bunch of irate inderviduals ive ever met. Im not suprised they have such a high accident rate as they obviously struggle to follow any kind of stuctured process....... Yes, italy is the land of contradictions, esp. when it comes to organizing work. Luckily, paramotoring is on the good side. Another contradiction: I'd say 80% or more of all paramotor engine brands are from italy, yet the sport is not so common over here. (It's Maranello btw). Weather pattern: not that I know of, we have Bora wind up north-east blowing at the border with Croatia, but it only affect a small area locally and we are more than 200 kms away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aquanaut Posted September 7, 2012 Author Share Posted September 7, 2012 Bloody hell, all I wanted to do was say hello! So far I'm having zero success with instruction/instructors in the North East. Most of the PPG guys I've met are self taught, the rest did training overseas. The worrying bit was the overseas trained guys all said for what they paid, it wasn't worth it - they could have figured out what they were taught in a couple of extra days alone, and a day with an experienced PPG pilot. So, what the hell do I do now? Other than getting airborne and freedom, so far I'm not feeling even remotely encouraged by what I'm hearing/reading. Is this the only uk forum, or are there others? I'm just trying to get a balanced opinion. No, I'm not trolling, I just genuinely want to get as much info as possible before I start spending hard cash. Cheers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_b Posted September 7, 2012 Share Posted September 7, 2012 Bloody hell, all I wanted to do was say hello! So far I'm having zero success with instruction/instructors in the North East. Most of the PPG guys I've met are self taught, the rest did training overseas. The worrying bit was the overseas trained guys all said for what they paid, it wasn't worth it - they could have figured out what they were taught in a couple of extra days alone, and a day with an experienced PPG pilot. So, what the hell do I do now? Other than getting airborne and freedom, so far I'm not feeling even remotely encouraged by what I'm hearing/reading. Is this the only uk forum, or are there others? I'm just trying to get a balanced opinion. No, I'm not trolling, I just genuinely want to get as much info as possible before I start spending hard cash. Cheers. Give Paul a ring at http://www.manchesterparagliders.com/ he may know some one up your way. Pete Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.