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Fresh breeze Sportix VS. Kobra Rocco super


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Hi

I'm in process of buying my Paramotor and I narrowed my choice to these two beauties.

Both of them have local dealers

Both of them are using Simonini Mini 2 plus

Both of them (apparently) have a reasonable quality.

FB will cost ~ A$1000 (Australian $) more.

I'm a fat b@stard 85kg (185 lb) and I'm a very aggressive pilot :explode:

Please help me choose.

Regards

Alex

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I have not seen any Kobra Paramotors here,

I have seen a shed load of FB's

Dan Burton flew the Tip to Tip on one, and it worked perfectly well for the entire trip.

I also know that Piers Dent isw a top bloke and will give you the very best of after sales support. (do not underestimate the value of this)

For the record, I have no comercial interests with either company.

SW :D

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I have not seen any Kobra Paramotors here,

I have seen a shed load of FB's

Dan Burton flew the Tip to Tip on one, and it worked perfectly well for the entire trip.

I also know that Piers Dent isw a top bloke and will give you the very best of after sales support. (do not underestomate the value of this)

For the record, I have no comercial interests with either company.

SW :D

Dan has been flying the same motor for years and fly's more than anyone else i know. Yesterday Dan and I flew from near okehampton to Bideford, arround Barnstable then down to Dartmoor, 2 flights over 80 miles, 3 hours flying. Dan has been doing flights like this on the same FB motor since ive known him.

Something to consider.

Whitters.

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IMO these are the 2 best paramotors out there for medium/heavy pilots.
Hey - what about the FlatTop I can hear Dave say... :lol:

Andy

Lol. But thanks for the thought Andy.

People will buy what they want to. When they've had a gutfull of breaking frames and props they might wish they'd bought a Flat-Top. It's hardly a commercial venture for me but if 6 people put down deposits tomorrow I import 6 Flat-Tops.

Whitters. Whilst I agree with most things you say, Dan is on his second unit and has broken both.. Once was at my farm and he couldn't repair it in time to fly with the rest. Neither could I, I admit, with wires melted to the engine on my Walkerjet. Frustrating business.

Dave

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IMO these are the 2 best paramotors out there for medium/heavy pilots.
Hey - what about the FlatTop I can hear Dave say... :lol:

Andy

Lol. But thanks for the thought Andy.

People will buy what they want to. When they've had a gutfull of breaking frames and props they might wish they'd bought a Flat-Top. It's hardly a commercial venture for me but if 6 people put down deposits tomorrow I import 6 Flat-Tops.

Whitters. Whilst I agree with most things you say, Dan is on his second unit and has broken both.. Once was at my farm and he couldn't repair it in time to fly with the rest. Neither could I, I admit, with wires melted to the engine on my Walkerjet. Frustrating business.

Dave

Hi Dave.

"Second unit" I am too embarrassed to count the motors I have been through in the time Dan has had his.

Until last year Dan has used the same engine. He only sent that back for refurb because it has done hundreds of hours. When it came back it had the new sportix frame and the Walbro carb. When I first met Dan (2005) he was using some cheap 2 stroke oil from a garage and was bouncing between synthetic to mineral at 50-1 and it still ran ok. Try that on your flat top Dave!!

He seized his reconditioned engine by leaning the high screw again and again in an attempt to achieve the same economy with his walbro carb as he did when he used a tillitson (or whatever its called).

Dan has never owned any other motor than his fresh Breeze. Has no plans to change. Ask him why.

Whitters. :D

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IMO the Flat Top is very good but there are a couple of reasons why I think the Kobra and the FB are better. the key one is the way they modify the motor to make it less stressed than how it is in its natural form in the FT. Personal opinion only. I was going to say that I think the FT with the new more powerful EVO version of the Simo is IMO the best option for the truly heavy pilot (as opposed to medium/heavy as I mentioned earlier).

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Whitters. Whilst I agree with most things you say, Dan is on his second unit and has broken both.. Once was at my farm and he couldn't repair it in time to fly with the rest. Neither could I, I admit, with wires melted to the engine on my Walkerjet. Frustrating business.

Dave

Hi Dave.

"Second unit" I am too embarrassed to count the motors I have been through in the time Dan has had his.

Until last year Dan has used the same engine. He only sent that back for refurb because it has done hundreds of hours. When it came back it had the new sportix frame and the Walbro carb. When I first met Dan (2005) he was using some cheap 2 stroke oil from a garage and was bouncing between synthetic to mineral at 50-1 and it still ran ok. Try that on your flat top Dave!!

He seized his reconditioned engine by leaning the high screw again and again in an attempt to achieve the same economy with his walbro carb as he did when he used a tillitson (or whatever its called).

Dan has never owned any other motor than his fresh Breeze. Has no plans to change. Ask him why.

Whitters. :D

Whitters

Reminds me of a story my Grandad told me about his turnip hoe. He said he'd had the same one for 45 years and didn't think anyone else had one that old. It'd had 5 new handles and he was on his 2nd blade, but it was still the same old hoe :?

Dave

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On the subject of engine loading, and just for information's sake (Simon :D ) The FT uses a 3-1/1 reduction drive, letting the engine rev more and so extracting the most power from the same lump. The FB and Rocco I believe are revving less with 2-8 or 2-6/1 ratios engine/prop revs. Less power but quieter perhaps. Less stress on the engine ? Questionable. When we climb hills with our cars we all change down a gear to let the engine rev more to get the power to climb the hill. Depends what you want. If it's loads of grunt to make TO's easier, high rate of climb and endless steep banking turns, you need power. Especially if you're a large chap.

I run my Simmo on semi synthetic £7 a litre at 40-1.

If anyone's managed to get their Simmo 200 to return 3 hours of flight for 10 litres of fuel, do speak up. And looking to increase on that as I've dropped from over 16 stone to well under 15 in the last 3 weeks.

Not knocking the other brands mentioned and hope it's not taken as such. Perfectly good units and would fly them happily myself

Dave

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  • 2 months later...

http://www.kobra-ppg.co.uk

85kg weight, I am 85 and fly my custom air titanium which has 65kg thrust. The Kobra Rocco Super puts out 85kg and the new Kobra Traktor (simo evo 33hp) puts out even more at 110kg. The weight shift arms on the Kobra are the best design I have seen. CNC machined, bearings and locking nut (not a bolt) very strong and safe. Tempted to order in an Traktor but what would I do with 110kg of thrust!!!!!

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hmmmm difference of opinion here/there.......can you stall a paraglider wing i( none porus ) ie in good condition with engine power alone.......I dont think ! you can

it will just settle in a climb come pull not a very efficient way to fly I know but if you dont touch the brakes or use momentum from a previous manover it wont stall.......this is what I was told by

Noel humphreys ex Paramotor instructor & freeflight instructor and ex UK paramotor Team member....... and the First Uk Pap dealer (now thats some CV ) of course if you use a high hang point you might get riser twist......or get a very bad torque reaction

(high and low hang points )

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hmmmm difference of opinion here/there.......can you stall a paraglider wing i( none porus ) ie in good condition with engine power alone.......I dont think ! you can

it will just settle in a climb come pull not a very efficient way to fly I know but if you dont touch the brakes or use momentum from a previous manover it wont stall.......this is what I was told by

Noel humphreys ex Paramotor instructor & freeflight instructor and ex UK paramotor Team member....... and the First Uk Pap dealer (now thats some CV ) of course if you use a high hang point you might get riser twist......or get a very bad torque reaction

(high and low hang points )

Put a light pilot on a powerful motor and you will stall the wing on full power

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disagree .......I need to borrow my mates tandem and find out

(at a suitable height of course) :shock:

Be carefull with a lot of power you will push yourself forward and up (as the wing holds back ie cannot fly fast enough) this will unload the wing resulting in a stall. :shock:

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I reckon if you stuck that 110kg thrust motor on me on a big wing it would stall. Then again with that thrust I could fly without the wing.

I only weigh 60 kg :roll: so if I got the center of thrust balanced i would have 40kg of excess thrust firing me straight up.

then again maybe it would just make this easier :acro:

still think it wont stall????????

Cheers col.......

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Stall...

Even under power, gravity plays a large part in forward momentum. Thrust out too far and you will unload your wing (not be putting enough weight on your risers), slow down and stall.

Now what if trims out on a fast wing like the fusion. How much thrust to pilot weight can it handle before the point of stalling??

As you say, maybe ditch the wing and just hover like inpector gadget.

When I start my two stroke motor I check that I can get full revs before I launch so I know I can climb out. How would I check full revs on a motor pushing out 110kg? with my face in the dirt I guess :lol:

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