geckofly Posted May 14, 2019 Share Posted May 14, 2019 Not pilots but motors ...I am flying a pap PA125 its got about 260 hrs running sweetly , thinking of upgrading frame and harness is it worth it ? back story is I have to run two motors one I leave in Spain and the other in the Uk ..the one I have in Spain(Ross 100) I bought 2006 has well over 600 hrs and still runs well but over the years has lost a bit of power and only good for sea level takeoffs , Am on the look out for one new motor but thinking i could upgrade the PA125 and leave that in Spain , but I really have no idea how long motors are designed to last ...any one have any suggestions or exoerience ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andyy Posted May 14, 2019 Share Posted May 14, 2019 It’s a funny one in the world of Paramotoring. It seems that Most people (that I have spoken too) think around 100ish hours is the time to get rid and buy a new one, however they will go indefinitely with correct maintenance and replacement parts. 2 stroke engines do need more work than a 4 stroke and require parts replacing more often, but if done right and you want to keep the motor going there is nothing stopping you. I guess the big part is supply of the parts and as engines get older manufacturers may stop making what you need. The biggest part however is engine development with engines getting lighter, more power from smaller units, better fuel economy and so on. I say if you are happy with the engine and can get the parts why not keep it going if you don’t feel the need for a new one. I had an engine at the start that I was struggling with and ended up selling it on but that was mostly due to confidence issues early doors but now wish I had stuck with it but the metal block I was having made me move it on (fully declaring the issues I had with the motor) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geckofly Posted May 15, 2019 Author Share Posted May 15, 2019 Thanks very much andyy good points . Wow 100 hrs ! That’s expensive airtime ;) ! With all of my motors I have had issues including serious ones new reduction drives holes in pistons etc but it’s almost as if you get through a period of troubles early on then you have a relatively long trouble free time . I guess the other thing to mention is the frames , linkages, and harness straps all wear over time . Doesn’t contribute to peace of mind wondering if they might be on the verge of giving up but don’t suppose there are any guidelines for that . Just common sense ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HangTen Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 For comparison, 2 stroke motors on Motorcycles and scooters for example can last thousands of hours. Of course, you can't fall from the sky on those. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidG4 Posted May 21, 2019 Share Posted May 21, 2019 In fareness you can't fall from the sky in a paramotor...the safety chute is already out anyway! You can be in a forced landing though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kiwi k Posted May 22, 2019 Share Posted May 22, 2019 On 21/05/2019 at 16:12, DavidG4 said: In fareness you can't fall from the sky in a paramotor...the safety chute is already out anyway! You can be in a forced landing though... Why if you have engine issues its No BIG deal you just glide back down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidG4 Posted May 23, 2019 Share Posted May 23, 2019 10 hours ago, kiwi k said: Why if you have engine issues its No BIG deal you just glide back down That's what's meant. Our wings are what most normal* folks Think of as parachutes and parachutes are safety chuteS. Engine stops...aircraft becomes parachutist. No big deal. Unless youre a crazy American flying over alligators. *they like keeping two feet firmly in the ground... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RighteousAviator Posted May 23, 2019 Share Posted May 23, 2019 I am fairly new to paramotors but have been a conventional pilot and airframe/powerplant mechanic for a long time. I agree with the lot who believe that the life of an engine expressed in hours is really irrelevant. As others are right to point out it's the maintenance you put it them that's important. Of course, maintenance is MONEY and sometimes, a lot of it. Friction and heat kill. Things wear down. Having said that, I bought my paramotor new and have encouraged my son to do the same (meaning that I've given him the money to do so!). Although some things are indeed obvious, I don't really know how well it's been maintained. Undoubtedly, I'm going to miss out on a true bargain here or there, but, such is life. Forgive me if I'm talking out my backside as I do not have significant experience with 2-strokes. I simply think the principles are the same. ----I just re-read the original post and I guess that 600 hr thing just slipped through my head. 600 hrs is a great run but I'd expect that you are in need of some heavy maintenance. It's sad to part with such a tool that allows you to do these amazing things but, again, such is life. In terms of this engine, it will fail soon. Not a life-ending event for us as paramotor pilots but, never-the-less, one that you should wish to avoid. Replace it and please be careful that it isn't sold to some naive, young and expectant pilot with no mechanical sense. Fly well, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geckofly Posted May 29, 2019 Author Share Posted May 29, 2019 On 23/05/2019 at 22:39, RighteousAviator said: I am fairly new to paramotors but have been a conventional pilot and airframe/powerplant mechanic for a long time. I agree with the lot who believe that the life of an engine expressed in hours is really irrelevant. As others are right to point out it's the maintenance you put it them that's important. Of course, maintenance is MONEY and sometimes, a lot of it. Friction and heat kill. Things wear down. Having said that, I bought my paramotor new and have encouraged my son to do the same (meaning that I've given him the money to do so!). Although some things are indeed obvious, I don't really know how well it's been maintained. Undoubtedly, I'm going to miss out on a true bargain here or there, but, such is life. Forgive me if I'm talking out my backside as I do not have significant experience with 2-strokes. I simply think the principles are the same. ----I just re-read the original post and I guess that 600 hr thing just slipped through my head. 600 hrs is a great run but I'd expect that you are in need of some heavy maintenance. It's sad to part with such a tool that allows you to do these amazing things but, again, such is life. In terms of this engine, it will fail soon. Not a life-ending event for us as paramotor pilots but, never-the-less, one that you should wish to avoid. Replace it and please be careful that it isn't sold to some naive, young and expectant pilot with no mechanical sense. Fly well, thanks for your thoughts RA. we all have a rough idea on serviceable flying hours for a wing, and a reserve parachute , fabric is far easier to predict in terms of degradation than a motor but i did think there might be some correlation, after all maintenance schedules are expressed in flying or run hours . Agree i am complete believer in good and timely maintenance . i drive a van which is now at 240.000miles still going strong and always been maintained . with my PAP Ross 100 now at over 600 hrs there is not one mark on the frame and never really spent lots on maintenance. I will replace it soon and it doesnt really owe me anything and dont worry I wont be selling it to an unaware newbie if at all. ! I guess its a testament to the quality of manufacture, engine and frame both. not sure all paramotors on the market would last that long , but then again having new gear if you can afford would give a bit more peace of mind Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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