Rant (well and truly over) about Paramotor Manufacturers

Posted this here to avoid hi-jacking Simons thread about the new Parajet Wankel -

Ian, not at all controversial chap

If you have had a bad time with your motor thats bad news, it's rubbish when you cant fly for any reason.

Have you taken it up with Parajet / the person you purchased it from?

SW

Hi Simon.

I cannot complain one little bit about the service from Parajet. They have always responded quickly when I have got in touch, mostly sending replacement bits free of charge. Especially good as I bought my machine nearly new from a 3rd party.

However, some of the quality control on things like the heads, exhaust mounts, starter rings etc have been an issue which has kept me on the ground more frequently than I care to remeber.

Very frustrating when you hear that there was a known issue that has been engineered around now but that my machine being manufactured prior to these solutions has fallen foul of! (i.e. casting problems on older heads, known problem with exhaust mounts that are too long and allow the prop to contact the exhaust with age, starter rings that are too soft and lose depth on their teeth meaning that it wont start)

If the parallel was to be drawn with cars (not the same as you can mostly just pull over in a car if you have a problem!) then these things might have been subject to a recall (even if at the owners expense). I would like to see paramotor manufacturers keeping in touch and being open/up front about improvements and fixes for known problems.

A bit of a rant but you did ask!!!

Best regards,

Ian

Again,

A forum is not the way to try to change that, you should e-mail them with your concernes and see what you get as a reply.

I also think that it is fair to say, (first hand witnessed in the last two weeks)

Most makes of motor break down.

One example, a motor in France had just come back from a £400 service (make not important) and after only a few hours of flight it siezed solid.

Another is an almost new Paramotor (again make not important, but non of the 3 are the same make) with only a few hours air time, had the exhaust fracture in to two in flight.

I guess, when you enter this sport you should know that its still very young, its a small market, People want better quality but dont want to pay for it. ( I am exactly like that myself)

I am sure that all manufactures of Paramotors would like to have this fed back through the system so they can ID the problem and stop it.

They are all businesses set up so that WE can do what we want to do. (worth remembering that sometimes)

I dont like the subject line of this thread, as we do not do 'ranting' on this forum. And I dont want to see this thread develop in to a slagging match.

SW

Simon, I don't think the odd 'rant' does any harm to the forum at all, and I think we can be too sensitive about upsetting delicate sensibilities.

A Forum is an ideal place to post disquiet about motors (call it a rant, complaint, moan, whatever you like), as it is likely to reach an audience of those who are likely to buy them. If we only talk to the manufacturer, I doubt very much that they are going to publicise their own failings, so the prospective customer is unlikely to ever find out about problems. The manufacturer might do something about the problem, then again, they might not. It depends on whether they see the cost of putting it right completely is more expensive than dealing with individual complaints.

It is exactly forums like this that I hunted through before buying my motor, to see if I could find out about any issues with it before purchase. If you stifle that sort of debate, you are doing your forum a disservice.

Phil

I agree with Phil, no honestly Phil I really do

If you restrict this debate Simon it then the forum won't have that nice feeling of free speech. I don't see there will be any slagging match. Ian's post was not in the slightest bit whiney, provocative or inflammatory.

We all want to be safe but we also want to be able to fly and its important to share experiences such as Ians.

Personally I wouldn't buy one of these as I don't know a single person who hasn't had a heap of problems and it was reading forums that made me realise this and go down the route of what I consider to be a more reliable manufacturer.

Sure all paramotors might have problems but some have more than others. When my Pap breaks or the engine stops suddenly I'll be the first to shout about it as I'm sure many others will.

I'm sure Ian has given all these comments to PJ but I don't think it helps to keep it a secret from others!

Malc

Malc, this can't be right. One or other of us must be feeling unwell!

I had a Merc 280E for a few years. After around 35000 miles the head gasket needed replacing and some work done on the head. After doing a little research it seems that for the particular engine installed this was a common problem but when I approached Mercedes they denied all knowledge. The job cost £750 so I sold the car within the next 15000 miles.

Manufacturers have access to feedback from distributors and the spares network, they know exactly what is strong and weak in their product, the customers problem is that they are essentially doing the R&D on the products and if the cost/benefit analysis isn't on the side of rectification, the redesign work isn't done and they bluff.

That is how they stay in business is their reply.

I am not a techy person by nature but I understand that to be the case.

I stand with the majority on this point, for a change. If you get a problem, shout it from the roof tops. You might just save your mates life.

Here's a list of problems I've had with the Flat Top in 10 months (60 hours use)

1 It had a small split, from new, in one of the prop blades (carbon fibre) 5 minute fix

2 One of the exhaust bolts broke (vibration/ fatigue) That's one of the pair which mount the silencer to the re-drive boss. Anyone with a Simonini unit should be aware of this. I removed the bolts and lock tighted in a proper pair of manifold studs with nuts, then lengthened the slots in the bracket to try to prevent a repeat.

3 If I find anything else I'll let you know

Dave

OK,

Point taken.

As long as the comments are not just 'moaning' (this is not a place to 'vent') then I have no problem and can see every benefit in it being here.

I just dont like to make anoyone annoyed at me / the forum, I am sure you can understand.

SW

As long as information is factual, and comments made are not libellous.

Eg, 'My mate told me that Parablogs paramotors have a deliberate design fault that the manufacturers are covering up, which rumour has it has killed three people'

Do you realise how nice it is to sit here reading this discussion, can you imagine what it would be like on the other side

Pete b

My point and well put.

SW

Isn't it wonderful Pete - this difference between a discussion/debate and a slanging match. I am not accusing anyone here, but if no-one cares about the tone of general conversation that is how you arrive at the farmyard.

LOL

I can see where there might be concern over this tit for tat boxing match between manufacturers and retailers, emerging from this kind of thread. Rest assured that I only intend to report faults with my machine or others that I fly regularly, where a problem has developed / been found whilst in my hands. I will always try to provide a fix, aswell, and not just point to the problem.

Dont hold your breath, you might not hear much for some time

I'm glad that this thread has been taken in the spirit in which it was intended!

I appreciate that this sport is relatively in its infancy. That's why experiences shared are so valuable. We can learn from each others challenges equally as much as our successes.

The fact that this potentially sensitive post is supported by the regulars on here is testimony to the strength of this forum.

Thanks,

Ian.

I contacted Parajet as suggested by Simon and they volunteered to take the motor in and give it some tender loving care free of charge and then warranty the work! Amazing customer service, even more-so considering that I bought my motor secondhand from a 3rd party.

I drove it to the factory yesterday and was Met by Giles and Andrew Scaramanga. Andrew took the motor straight into the workshop and immediately started working on it. They anticipate having it for a week or so, during which time Giles has kindly offerred to test fly it over several flights, changing anything which is not up to his high standards.

I now feel a bit of an arse for not giving Parajet the opportunity to offer this before shooting my mouth off!!

I can't imagine that many paramotor manufacturers give this level of customer service, especially to someone who has maligned their product on an open forum (yes, cringingly they had read my previous posts and take feedback very seriously).

Any paramotor by their nature can have problems. As previously mentioned Parajet have sent me upgraded/improved parts free of charge in the past and are now getting my motor up to current spec. It will hopefully now be as reliable as a new machine which already incorporates these improvements.

The way that Parajet have gone beyond the call of duty leads me to say that anyone considering a new paramotor should have no hesitation in chosing one from Parajet.

I will of course update this thread once my machine is back from being loved!!!

Best regards,

Ian.

Nice to hear you are being looked after Ian.

Pete b

Cheers Pete.

I stood a better chance of being looked after by phoning Parajet rather than just moaning on here!!!

Best regards,

Ian.

I think in many respects, the result is better than if you had just quietly gone to ParaJet and they had quietly sorted your problem.

This way, everyone heard about the problem, and has now very publicly been made aware of the high quality customer relations that are being applied. Kudos to ParaJet by the way.

Oh, and Kudos to you too for removing the foot you planted in your mouth