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Lead Acid to Lithium Iron.


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Amazing!

I have just replaced the 12v 7AH battery that I use for my Gyroscopic stabiliser....

The original Lead acid weight is 2.42KG

The new Lithium Iron weight is..... 320gm !!

Just thought I would share that one.

SW :D

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Very interesting, can I ask where you got it and the price?

I'm very likely to add lithium iron batteries into my existing lead acid battery portfolio and so this is very relavant to me.

Will then have them in stock in the UK ready for next day delivery or same day collection.

Cheers,

Ian.

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Shorai just installed in my rig replacing the lead acid.

Nice finish, well provided padding to replace virtually any current setup even if you chose more capacity (x2+).

Can't comment on starts yet as just now installed.

This is the light replacement we've been waiting for that charges in flight without flames.

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I'm looking at importing these -

http://www.shoraipower.com/

Hi Ian,

Am I right in thinking these are a sort of halfway stage to Li-Po batteries (lighter & more powerful than lead-acid) but connect directly to the in flight charging system with no mods ?

If so, I would be very interested if there is a replacement for mine : http://www.mdsbattery.co.uk/datasheets/hr_1224w.pdf

(I couldn't find anything similar on your link).

Thanks, Alan

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Hi Guys.

The link Simon posted to Ebay shows a Li-pol battery. (DEBEN TRACER LITHIUM POLYMER POWER PACK 12V 5Ah LIGHT)

These are great but need to be handled with care.

They can burst into flames if incorrectly charged.

Use only the charger provided. If you want to use this battery to start your paramotor, YOU MUST DISCONNECT THE CHARGING CIRCUIT.

In my opinion it is too low a voltage and only just enough amps to start a motor. (needs the extra cell to make it 14.8V).

But perfect for running cameras etc as Simon said.

I am only talking about Lithiun ion polymers here (li-pol)

The Shorai's look great if they can be installed with the inbuilt charging circuit! I think they are Lithium Iron Phosphate (yes iron not ion).

Here is a review of a Shorai LFX

http://www.batterystuff.com/knowledge-b ... cle&id=185

Cheers

Mike

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Thanks for the clarification Mike.

Just to confirm - Please do not connect the Li-Pol batteries from Simon W's link into the onboard charging system as Li-Pols are very fussy about their charging and can catch fire if incorrectly charged!

I am at the very early stage of setting up a dealership in the UK for Shorai and other brands of Lithium iron phosphate batteries (not ion as I mistakenly previously posted!). Shorai stock over here is a bit of an issue due to the earthquake in Japan and the exponential growth in interest but they are due in the next few weeks.

Lithium iron batteries can be directly substituted in place of the existing lead acid batteries without modifying the charging system. They have many additional benefits over lead acid, including -

- Much less weight (1/3 of the weight for twice the amp hour and cranking capacity)

- Much lower self discharge so wont go flat between flights

- Higher cranking voltage so a faster crank and easier start

- Will not leak!

They are however quite a bit more expensive.

The replacement for the YT4L-BS as used in Parajet is the LFX07L2-BS12

http://www.shoraipower.com/p-146-lfx07l2-bs12.aspx

This compares as follows -

YT4L-BS.............3 Amp Hours......30 Cold cranking Amps.......1.45Kg.......114mm(L) x 71mm(W) x 86mm(H)

LFX07L2-BS12......7 Amp Hours.....102 Cold cranking Amps......0.46Kg.......113mm(L) x 58mm(W) x 89mm(H)

Alan - Shorai currently make 2 box sizes and both are thicker than your 51mm wide battery, so perhaps one of these might be a better fit?

http://www.coreracing.co.uk/superb.php

I've been waiting for this technology to mature and although it's early days yet, it seems like it's finally here! :D

Best regards,

Ian.

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Thanks for the info and links. I would need to modify the battery mount in either case, but not a massive problem.

For my motor I would probably go for the LFX09L2-BS12, saving over 1.4kg from my current battery. I'd be very interested in price once you sort the import / dealership.

The SuperB 2600 apears similar spec to my current battery for power, but they don't recommend it for 2-stroke use, or anything below 10 degrees C. The one they recommend is the 5200 which has amazing power but heavier than the Shorai (still under half the weight of current battery). Perhaps more models will appear in the range soon....

Looks like they will all recharge in flight from standard system, or from a bog standard mains charger - although I can't use my high quality Optimate charger as it has desulphating and conditioning / trickle charge functions. Can you confirm this, or if they will charge from a simple cigarette lighter socket ?

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They can charge from any constant differential charger - solar, wall wart 12v charger, system charging.

Desulphating or 'smart' chargers deliver pulses to crack crystals which are a no no for lithium iron cells.

Do be careful about maximum voltage applied however as there is a limit in the manual. Many solar chargers can exceed this without a voltage regulator.

Cold starts have the added benefit of heating the battery in lithium iron, making your second whirl much more likely a start then a lead acid, which simply gets worse. Internal resistance thing.

In flight chargers can be wired in for cell/gps/radio, but word of warning - the 12v cigarette adapters often contain resistive elements to create a voltage drop to 9v/5v/3v - these are effectively heaters and will suck your battery dead often without a charge load connected. Part of pre/post trip if you use them. If they're plugged in, they're draining your battery.

More questions answered here:

http://www.shoraipower.com/t-faq.aspx

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The replacement for the YT4L-BS as used in Parajet is the LFX07L2-BS12

http://www.shoraipower.com/p-146-lfx07l2-bs12.aspx

This compares as follows -

YT4L-BS.............3 Amp Hours......30 Cold cranking Amps.......1.45Kg.......114mm(L) x 71mm(W) x 86mm(H)

LFX07L2-BS12......7 Amp Hours.....102 Cold cranking Amps......0.46Kg.......113mm(L) x 58mm(W) x 89mm(H)

That would be a good weight saving, and I would consider it, though for the cost I would probably be better off running to work every day to get rid of 1kg of excess weight instead!

Looking at those figures, it appears that the alternative offers considerably better performance. Would it be possible to go down a size to save even more weight - I can't imagine needing better performance than the battery currently fitted to the machine. The only time that I ran it flat was when I flooded the engine (I shouldn't have kept trying - my fault).

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My Li Po arrived today...

(Not Li Iron)

But... It works amazingly well, it spins up the gyroscope in about 2 mins (as apposed to the 4-5 mins from the lead acid)

Not sure how long it will last yet, but the lead acid was 4 hours so I assume this one will last about 3 as it is 2AH less. (but it has a much better power curve throughout its charge range.

Happy.

SW :D

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  • 3 months later...

Finally posting on starting capabilities of the shorai LiFe batteries....

When I got mine, I installed it, and left it as I didn't want to mess with a charger that might cause problems.

That, and I was curious about their claim on self discharge and shelf life.

My homebuilt electric pack used a car jump starter kit 7AH battery originally, and I (over a couple months) kept tapping the "check charge" button I carried over to the paramotor. It stayed green (13v+) for the duration it sat. Factory charge with no top up.

When I got to using it, it spun my mini2 over almost exactly like the original lead battery on full charge.

After ten minutes of motor charge time and a cool down, it spun it like it was really supposed to - like 20-30% faster on whirl over.

Amperage rocks. Quite happy with it so far and pleased to not need to trickle charge every so often.

I'm liking Lithium Iron. For the needs of a paramotor, Lithium Polymers have too much hassle/risk attached to them.

Just sayin.

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