Jump to content

Technical advice please.


flyingdoc
 Share

Recommended Posts

Dear All,

I have a 29m2 Dudek Synthesis wing with trimmers and speed bar. I was taught to take off with trim set to neutral. Fly mostly with trims fully open and land with neutral again. Leaving the red zone (Fully on) for thermaling only.

I understand that the trimmers are effectively equivalent to flaps on an ordinary wing so I can see how 'dropping the flaps' (fully on trim) will give more lift and make you fly slower and thus make thermals easier to catch and keep. Presumably there is still a small degree of reflex in the wing at this point???(Does anyone know for sure??)

Logically for me I would like to think of the trim as a way to choose speed v lift. ie on fully off/open (Blue zone) we can fly faster but with less lift therefore needing more power to maintain height. Using up fuel more quickly but travelling faster too. Fully on/closed (red zone) would provide more lift with a slower speed but less power to maintain height and therefore using fuel less quickly.

Am I wrong in imagining that there would be a 'most efficient ' position ie maximum range on one tank, which balances off speed and fuel economy and lift? Is this at the neutral position or above or below it?

Is it also reasonable ( As recommended in the Nucleon manual) to begin with a mostly fully on trim position (More classic paraglider like flight characteristics) and explore the blue zone when more confident in flying?(The Synth manual states to take off and land in the neutral position but sometimes this requires a lot of running???)

Also more logically is it safe/reasonable to choose to use fully on (red zone) to take off in nil wind conditions so I get more lift at a slower speed and don't have to run around like an idiot........ Similarly would nil wind landings be easier in the fully on(red zone ) position.

Sorry that this is a long question but I hope that some of the more technically minded out there can clear this up for me.

Otherwise I have to say that I am just loving the flying. I have now done eight hours and finally done a trully solo launch at a field of my own choosing with no instructor present, which was pretty cool.

I guess that makes me a proper pilot now!!

:launchdance::launchdance: :launchdance: :launchdance:

Woooo Woooo!

All help very gratefully received and appreciated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

well doc,

all the questions i have you have just very articulativley asked!!

personally i have the same wing -- size 34, and i have never ever used trimmers on less than zero ( i thought this was more suited for free flying only ) , i always launch on zero trim, then in my short 3 hrs worth of flying i drop the trimmers out to full occasionally -- more so if its a bit bumpy -- makes me feel more secure.

if you struggle to launch on zero trim - apply some brake -- im 19stone so find doing a benny hill down the fields somewhat tiring!. not to much brake though - to avoid a stall. But having said that, ive had my hands well down and not even come close to stalling the wing.

look forward to hearing the rest of your replies!!

come down to stoke sometime bud

Link to comment
Share on other sites

FlyingDoc"]Dear All,

I have a 29m2 Dudek Synthesis wing with trimmers and speed bar. I was taught to take off with trim set to neutral. Fly mostly with trims fully open and land with neutral again. Leaving the red zone (Fully on) for thermaling only.

YES

I understand that the trimmers are effectively equivalent to flaps on an ordinary wing so I can see how 'dropping the flaps' (fully on trim) will give more lift and make you fly slower and thus make thermals easier to catch and keep. Presumably there is still a small degree of reflex in the wing at this point???(Does anyone know for sure??)

I doubt it very much when you are flying like this you would actively pilot the wing so reflex would be useless IF it were there

Logically for me I would like to think of the trim as a way to choose speed v lift. ie on fully off/open (Blue zone) we can fly faster but with less lift therefore needing more power to maintain height. Using up fuel more quickly but travelling faster too. Fully on/closed (red zone) would provide more lift with a slower speed but less power to maintain height and therefore using fuel less quickly.

More or less yes but its a bit more complicated than that

Am I wrong in imagining that there would be a 'most efficient ' position ie maximum range on one tank, which balances off speed and fuel economy and lift? Is this at the neutral position or above or below it?

First part of the Q yes. Im not sure you would have to do some testing to find out.

Is it also reasonable ( As recommended in the Nucleon manual) to begin with a mostly fully on trim position (More classic paraglider like flight characteristics) and explore the blue zone when more confident in flying?(The Synth manual states to take off and land in the neutral position but sometimes this requires a lot of running???)

Use the thrust to push you until you cannot run any faster then apply a bit of brake and you should take off, you need to get the wing up to Flying speed.

Also more logically is it safe/reasonable to choose to use fully on (red zone) to take off in nil wind conditions so I get more lift at a slower speed and don't have to run around like an idiot........ Similarly would nil wind landings be easier in the fully on(red zone ) position.

No you may find that the wing will then hang back and you will not get enough speed up, same as running with some brake on.

Sorry that this is a long question but I hope that some of the more technically minded out there can clear this up for me.

No problem if you dont ask you dont get answers

Otherwise I have to say that I am just loving the flying. I have now done eight hours and finally done a truly solo launch at a field of my own choosing with no instructor present, which was pretty cool.

Well done now keep it up

I guess that makes me a proper pilot now!!

Yes

:launchdance::launchdance: :launchdance: :launchdance:

Woooo Woooo!

All help very gratefully received and appreciated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thanks Pete for the prompt reply.

One confusion I have is that the synth Manual says take off on neutral and the Nucleon manual says take of on fully on (red zone). Yes I know they are different wings, but made by the same people with a similar concept???

Anyway obviously I need more practice.

:launchdance::launchdance::launchdance:

Need more practice. Need more practice. Need more practice.

Thanks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It would seem to me that takeoff trim recommendations will have their source in the designers concept and test pilots input when they sort out the Manual for the wing.

As you say Doc, different wings, different shape, different concept at the design stage and different target pilot.

I wouldn't have thought that calibrations on one wing necessarily equate to the same setting on another - setting to wing configuration.

Like a number of things, never get too much and the practice is essential.

This piece comes with a health warning Doc, I am no expert when it comes to wings, just surmising.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My advice is,

Try your synth's trimmers in all places from closed fully up to nutral again.

I seem to remember when I had a Synth that I found it better 'for me' to have them about an inch under the nutral.

Now I fly the Fusion of course, but even so.. I still take off close to nutral even though 'reccomended take off' is much lower on the tabs.

In a nut shell....

Each to there own. Try it. :D

SW :D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As one who is just venturing into the world of reflex, I dont know all the answers either. But from watching a mate struggle to get a slow launch by trying the fully slow mode, I can say things improved when we put him into takeoff mode. On fully slow his wing lagged back. I'm only guessing, but if you have more headwind, you could maybe up the setting a little and if less you could down it ? Is this good or am I barking up the wrong tree completely ?

Dave

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share



  • Upcoming Events

    No upcoming events found
×
×
  • Create New...