Mark Pugh

Hi Simon, as the local training site/school, do you rent for the day for suitably qualified pilots to remain "current" between learning and buying kit? I'm not asking about a days lesson, I mean just turning up, signing a form for accidents/repairs, and then being able to do a few circuits of the field just to try and remain current and in practise.

I'll be buying second-hand, so don't think I'll have much choice in the make !

When I scrounge up the money, I'll be asking everyone I know in the sport/hobby to watch out for me. Realise I'll have to buy older (probably heavier) kit, but as I said, I need to buy just something suitable for a years worth of flying to see if I need to upgrade and spend a fortune. It is the thought of buying it all new (the ideal) and then hardly using it because of several factors, as it loses value in the back of the garage... I'm sure lots of people do this and I can't even contemplate the thought of the possibility of buying it all new. This is not a sport where the value of the kit appreciates over the years!!!

I'm still flying my 20 year old Edel Sector, still enjoying it and it was passed as airworthy by Aerofix, much to our surprise. Every time we fly, we take a risk, we must judge when the risk is worth it, or if we should not fly in that particular days conditions. I live too far from the hills to fly frequently, but having a motor may allow me to fly nearer home and even just in the evenings. I'm right out in the country and know several farmers who will allow me to fly occasionally. Years of shooting and metal detecting on local land.

I really started this conversation to see how much people needed to start the hobby, or see if I was completely out-of-my-depth.

Yes, I have started my para-kit kitty, but I'm only up to £300 so far ! It is going to take a while.

Annoyingly at the same time I have £12k scheduled for a second hand family car; my wife has just ordered the new, small, Nissan Leaf 2, which is due out in February next year, so we'll wait for the March number plate change over. This means the family needs a larger car for 4 adults and two Labradors. My wife will quite happily pay our funds towards family cars, but not to my expensive (SILLY) hobby. She does earn four times my salary and generally keeps me in a manner to which I've become accustomed. Looking for a 3 year old Nissan Qashqai but just found out the 1.5 l diesel does not come in automatic!

I remember those perfect carefree days of bachelor-hood, where my money was spent quite happily on my toys. Times change and not always for the better. I will struggle and slowly save up the money, I will have to buy cheap, thinking £2k on motor, £500 reserve (mine are both well over twenty years old) and £750 for a wing. That means getting at least £3k together minimum. Heh, I'm 10% of the way there!

Think positive, it will happen. I well might have 20 hours on them and absolutely love the flying..... or I might get thrown around, break a few props, scare myself stupid and decide it's not for me! But those first hours will let me know if I should spend a lot more money. There must be others who spend £10k and never use it again! Nice idea, not so good in practise.

To tell the truth, I can't imagine keeping my job for another 3 years, it's a horrible job. So finance is not an option either.

Great to have this forum, when I have saved up the money, I'm sure there will be people on here who can help me source a suitable beginner kit. MAY BE  A WHILE

52 minutes ago, AndyB said:

wings  

 http://www.pgbase.co.uk/equipment-hire/

Unfortunately no paramotoring kit, but £30 a day would be ideal if you were a visiting pilot from overseas.

Getting 20 flights is great advice, just what I need. It would surely let me know if I was interested in spending big and doing more of this sport. I already have a full set-up to paraglide, but it's a competition wing and not at all suitable for a motor. My two reserves, although annually re-packed are not large enough for the extra weight of a motor.

Therefore I require, motor, suitable wing and a new reserve.

After 20 flights on beginner kit, I would imagine I'd want to upgrade the wing for an intermediate with larger speed range and more suitable for flights into wind when necessary.

Obviously I need to buy the beginner kit that someone else has out-grown! Or rent a basic kit, that would be the ideal. I am sure that once someone has invested £9k in new kit they are not going to want to lend it to anyone, not even their best mate. Fully understood, but surely there are also people that bought some kit, quite liked the sport, so kept the kit, but for one reason or another haven't flown for a couple of years and maybe never again will. £200 for someone else to get there 20 "early learner" flights might be ideal to them!

I also realise that one propeller replacement would cost more than this, but that's an insurance risk I have to take with my own kit or borrowed/hired kit.

I live in hope (and near Stratford-on-Avon) !!

I would even just like to be ground crew for any local pilots, helping set-up, following/retrieving by car, even just photography and video. It would all be great experience and encourage/discourage me to keep saving up. The kitty is slowly rising and there is my birthday and Christmas coming up

I just need to save the surplus money, not spend the normal family income !

I've been seeing lots of paramotors and wings for £2k on ebay, even know a few people that have bought them. The lessons were cheap to give it a go, just not aware of the push to buy new at £9k for kit I might out-grow in a year; everyone tells you not to buy kit that is older than two years old. I simply could not even afford £2k today, even if the right kit came along. But I have started saving and have nominated myself for overtime at work.

Do I sell some of my other hobby equipment off? I have a top model metal detector and a fantastic coin collection, from Celtic, Roman, hammered medieval, to modern milled coins; this is valuable (my stamp collection has plummeted in value!!!), but selling these collections for a new hobby I'm not 100% sure I would continue to do, is a dodgy call. The coins are mostly silver and are appreciating nicely.... BUT, it's only money!

I have got a Roman silver hoard going through the Treasure Trove process, I share the value with the land owner, but no-one knows the actual value and it will take 2 years!!! Hey-ho, I don't do the lottery, but two weeks of full-on over time would be perfect right now. In my profession the over-time is not guaranteed, but when it's available it can be almost unlimited!!!

It would be damn useful if someone with kit that wasn't using it, would rent it out to me !!!! Surely using it is almost better than keeping it in a garage! I live in hope! Whilst taking lessons it only cost £30 a day (plus any breakages - none luckily!). But this price is only available in lessons....

When I did not have a family, I would always find the money, but now there are different priorities to life. AND, there is no-way that my wife would let me use "our" money for a dangerous sport, I have told her what my life policy is worth, but it hasn't changed her mind. We have been married 18 years, you'd think she would be pleased to let me go

Great, would love to fly over that area with a paramotor; but can't imagine when I'll have enough saved to buy any kit! Does anyone hire it on a daily basis???

31 minutes ago, Steve said:

My mistake, I assumed you trained with Axis in an area south of the Beacons. 

I did, based near Merthyr; but normal field (near Fochriw )was very wet and muddy; so we met on the south coast to train.

3 hours ago, Steve said:

Congratulations Mark!  

You learned in my neck of the woods, did you get to fly over Pen y Fan? 

No idea, we flew at Port Talbot, Aberavon beach near the sailing club/ragworm farm. For our higher, out-of-circuit flights we flew across the river and past Swansea University. Great site to learn, very laminar onshore breeze, forward and reverse launching. During lunch we could soar the dunes!

Did finally learn, October 25 and 26 in South Wales. Most flying done on first day then theory exam and one more out of circuit flight on second day. Then another flight for fun!!!

Great fun, worth doing, now got my BHPA rating, but can't afford the kit

In the early 1990's I started to learn to paraglide, after a days tuition I learnt the cost of the kit and never went back for another lesson; I would never be able to afford that much money on a hobby! Then 6 months later a friend I was a ski instructor with in Europe bought a new wing and I asked what he was doing with his old one. He suggested it was only worth 1000 Austrian Schillings (£300) and I bought it off him without even seeing it! I was the proud owner of an "Inferno" with built in harness! Then I took ten days lessons with Brian Webb in Australia (flying every day!) and spent a whole season on my Inferno wing. Occasionally managing to soar, but mostly 20 minutes top-to-bottoms in the Alps.

At that point you find the money for new kit, upgrade to new wing, harness and reserve; you love the sport and money is no object....

Over the next ten years, I upgraded another four times until I had a competition wing and was flying in comp's all over the World; several over 100km's, race to goal at 126 km's (second on day, 12 made goal) and even an over 100 mile flight.

Now over 20 years later I have learnt to paramotor with Steve at Axis; my BHPA licence now has the power rating and I'm looking at the kit. I need a paramotor, wing and reserve, minimum; none of my old kit is suitable, well maybe my flytec instrument!

To buy new is out of the question. Approx. £9000 is never going to happen. Old second hand kit that has been left in a garage for 10 years is probably now heavy, dangerous and no longer suitable, especially for a beginner. There is loads of kit on ebay like this.

The 6 million dollar question is....

How much do I need to spend to get kit that is suitable? Is it possible for 2-3 thousand pound? I hear about people that buy a whole set up for £1000, and actually get to fly with it.

If in a years time, I have clocked up a good amount of time and still enjoy paramotoring, then I can upgrade and spend a small fortune, knowing I will make the most of it. I'm really not in a position to spend £5k to put it in the back of my garage and never use again....

How do people afford this hobby?

I was actually amazed at how low the revs were required to maintain height, I'd always presumed just to negate gravity I'd have to run the motor at almost full speed. It reminds you that whilst paragliding you are always looking for the next thermal, it is only as you leave at cloud-base that you are not concentrating 100% on finding lift. With the motor it was possible to float around at any height.

Spent last two days (25 & 26 October 2017) with Steve from Axis, in South Wales. Just two students and we had quite a lot of experience already paragliding and competing, but my experience was from a long time ago!

Have been trying to get lessons for the last month, but too many storms were hitting South Wales, much too windy and wet. But finally Steve got in touch by internet to say Wednesday might be suitable on the beach. We met at 09:30 near Port Talbot and walked all the kit through the sand dunes and onto the beach as the sea started to go out. Much of the morning was showing we had good paraglider skills, reverse launching, even flying the sand dunes. We then checked the motor over and got used to the throttle whilst it was strapped to our backs. Then having to run along the beach with a running motor.

After lunch we got strapped in and with the weight of the engine on our backs got used to reverse launching and keeping the wing above our heads whilst we attempted to run into wind....

Then the engine was turned on, and what had been a big, heavy, cumbersome unit suddenly became light as we revv'ed up and ran into the wind, feeling a little like John Cleese doing a silly walk!

Into the air, gain height, let go of brake controls to get seat comfortable and then the knowledge of how much easier it was to turn one way rather than the other!

We each made three smaller circuits, lasting 4 to 8 minutes; with spot landings back at the windsock and with the power turned off at approx. 100 feet. Great landings, on our feet, in the right place.

Then longer flights of approx. 15-25 minutes with a height gain of over 1500 feet. Much more time to play in the air.

At the end of the day, we looked at the next days forecast and although it started poor, the afternoon looked promising. So we stayed the night locally. Next day we did a lot more theory inside a café, completed the 40 question exam and then went back to the beach for the afternoon. After checking all the equipment, we made more, longer flights and really got comfortable with the equipment. I have to admit, my take-offs seemed to get worse, not better, but after turning and applying the throttle, not one was aborted. Before each flight I still had "butterflies" in my stomach and the uneasy feeling of "what am I doing this for!" But once in the air, it was all SO WORTH IT.

We are now Club Pilots and can fly from, and near, sites that have been checked by an Instructor and found suitable. After logging a few more hours, we can then become full pilots and choose our own suitable flying sites.

I recommend you download the App. "XCSoar" on any smart phone. It takes a short while to understand and set up for a paraglider, but follow the instructions on youtube. Then later when you are flying it can show you where you are in real time, just be aware that it "sups" a lot of power from your battery and you may need to add a battery back-up for longer flights.

Hi All, new member hoping to learn to fly paramotors VERY soon.....

I have the whole of October 2017 off work, to cross-over from paragliding (375 hours, Advanced rating) to paramotoring. Keen to learn with either of two local schools, but "paramotortraining.com" with Simon near Swindon is the closest and probably has the better set-up for wind direction and dry ground!

When is the weather going to improve????

Really thought that a whole month would give me the two days necessary to convert. But already we are half way through!

Decided to go the paramotor route because I live miles from any hills near Stratford-on-Avon; I used to have my own winch but there are too many height restrictions over my local fields to thermal up higher, due to Birmingham Airport and that is unlikely to close down any time soon.... As long as I stay below 1300m's I can travel in most directions except north!!!