Epsilon-5 for paramotor use

[dmpatanis]

Hello,i have the Advance Epsilon-5 28 wing and i use it as a paragliding.

Now i change the risers for a paramotor and i dont know the use of the trims.

What happens when i open it and when i push it down???(in paramotor use)

When i must open it??

Thanks a lot.

[t_andrews]

The Advance paramotor risers are effectively speedbar on the rear of the risers.

Advance didn't say this, so use your own judgement, but I suggest that if you have opened the trimmers all the way, you should NOT use speedbar at that time as the effect is additive. it would be like using twice the speedbar which you nomally could not do.

Use them as you would speedbar but carefully consider the risk of a frontal if you use both at the same time fully.

That said, I always meant to try it at altitude, but switched to a Fusion wing before it happened.

Now I simply dispense warnings...

[padeakin]

The Advance paramotor risers are effectively speedbar on the rear of the risers.

Advance didn't say this, so use your own judgement, but I suggest that if you have opened the trimmers all the way, you should NOT use speedbar at that time as the effect is additive. it would be like using twice the speedbar which you nomally could not do.

Use them as you would speedbar but carefully consider the risk of a frontal if you use both at the same time fully.

That said, I always meant to try it at altitude, but switched to a Fusion wing before it happened.

Now I simply dispense warnings...

This is not always the case, many modern paragliders have some reflex designed into the centre of the wing, paramotor trimmers on a paraglider wing can be designed to change the shape of the wing and increase the reflex, whereas a speedbar normally changes the angle of attack but does not normally change the shape of the wing.

Maybe t_andrews answer is correct and on the advance they simply work like a speed bar, but to be sure I think the original question should be sent to Advance, if the answer is not in the manual.

Paul D

[t_andrews]

Worthy warning on my warning.

Since I was retrofitting an E4 I did ask - here is Advance's response:

"The motor riser don’t changes the AOA in neutral/no trimm.

The paramotor risers are specially made for the EPSILON 5 - they're not tested for the

EPSILON 4 or any other model.

Unfortunately we don’t have more informations to share.

In general, the EPSILON 4 is a more dynamic glider then the EPSILON 5 – so we think, that also his reactions when flown with open trimmers will be more dynamic then those of the EPSILON 5."

So, I admit freely that I am making an assumption based on how they physically function on the risers, the E5 is a indeed conventional wing.

Your mileage may vary.

[dmpatanis]

Hello i have a question that i can't give an answer.

I cant understand why the Advance Epsilon 5 -28 wing for free flight has a weight range 78-106kg,and when you want to use it for a paramotor the same wing has 100-146kg range by DULV??

Can you explain this?????

Thanks a lot.

[t_andrews]

The test reports on:

http://para2000.org/wings/advance/epsilon5.html

for the 28 only note ACTUAL testing to 106kg max load.

http://para2000.org/wings/advance/epsil ... tests.html

So it seems for an E5-28, there wasn't even a test done for max load (40kg short) in free flight mode.

This is 60kg short of "paramotor" allowed max mass, which has no published basis anywhere.

I too am curious what measure is used to attached seemingly excessive and arbitrary weight ranges to this and most other wings when stamped "for paramotor". It's as if there's some magic behind how the same wing can be readily used for an overloaded flight situation, with no need to publish any data supporting it. Mind you, we all jump right in and fly them anyway.

Surely there is some reasoning behind it, if only arbitrary marketing hype, but enlightenment is always welcome.

So +1 on your general query.

I have never held those measures with any trust, however given the relatively standard 8G rating of most wings ground tested that measure may be applied in proportion to one's "over" loading with a fair margin of G loading prior to failure.

Flight characteristics can be expected to change with loading as always.

We sign up for that one too as "test pilots" every flight.

An answer to the high paramotor ranges would do well to remove a personal peeve.

Inquiring minds wanna know.

[paramotormike]

I'm sure I commented on this before, as I have an Advance Epsilon 5.

I then had it fitted with Paramotor risers, which have the twin per side hook in system.

“Both in” to keep the Paragliding certification and the trimmers out for Paramotoring.

I also contacted the manufacturer and had at best a vague answer, "yes, more likely to have a frontal collapse if trim out and full speed bar on full"

I pushed to ask how likely this might be etc etc. Didn’t get a real answer.

Anyway, in the real world flying, I tested out the speed range and gained a small increase in overall speed (just a few km's). So decided it was not worth the worry of a frontal and just fly in Paraglider mode.

The wing is way to slow in any mode to keep up with the reflex wings, so now I use it for paragliding, or Paramotoring, if I want to go for height, as it is very efficient.

Cheers

Mike