morgy Posted January 4, 2013 Share Posted January 4, 2013 It still sounds like your doing something a little wrong if it takes you 6 pulls to start it when hot/warm.. Make sure when its hot to just crack the throttle take it past the compression then pull. When cold a few pumps again take past compression then pull.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyfreefly Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 The engine now have 7 hours on it. Here is a new video I made flying at Raglan on the west coast of the North Island: http://youtu.be/UYDufihUDUw [youtubevideo] [/youtubevideo] You lucky lucky Bugger.....I know the area well up till my accident I went there every year for a couple of months for the surfing and paragliding your video makes me ACHE soooo bad to be back there.... Did the campsite give you permission to fly from the airstrip ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoolw Posted January 6, 2013 Author Share Posted January 6, 2013 Hi No, I didn't know it was a private air field . But there was no other traffic and no one tried to stop me Was it a paragliding accident? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyfreefly Posted January 6, 2013 Share Posted January 6, 2013 No not paragliding......the much more dangerous sport of paramotoring whilst in the belief I was invincible coming up to two years in May and still unable to Run properly ( But I can Surf again JUST ) its wheels for me a previous post will run you through it viewtopic.php?f=17&t=6260 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoolw Posted January 24, 2013 Author Share Posted January 24, 2013 Hi sorry to bring this post back up again I now have the problem with the pulley system mostly sorted out. (It is not as good as the Bailey frame , but good enough) I have no problems anymore with starting the engine from cold, with the engine on my back. I still sometimes have a problem when starting it once the engine is warm. What happens is, when I pull it feels like the engine fires and then rip the pull chord back, and then stops, this will then keep on happening and I then have to start it on the ground. Has someone experieced this problem? or know what might be the cause? Other than this problem, I'm very happy with the Bailey engine and would buy one again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgy Posted January 24, 2013 Share Posted January 24, 2013 Hi Jacoolw I think this is down to your starting technique. When hot/warm you should not need to prime the motor with the throttle. MAKE SURE your going PAST the compression before trying to start it. Also make sure your not just stabbing at the pull start. Give it a long pull. How many hours do you have on the Machine now??? Have you checked the Valve clearance??? I find on a new motor the belt needs to be tenstioned after 4-6 hours esp in this country when its cold and damp... You should be ok But this will not be the cause of your NEW Issue Let me know if this helps Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybluerob Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 HiAre there any Bailey v5 owners who are able to pull start the engine while in the harness? I have arms like a baboon but just can't start it while in the harness, even when the engine is warmed up. I follow the manual starting recommendations to the letter. With the engine on the ground it will take between 5 and 8 pulls to start when cold and 4 - 6 when warm. I use the recommended oil and 98 octane petrol. Someone suggested the that pull cord is to long? Jaco Parajet Zenith (Bailey) v5 I've had problems starting my V5 from new. I'm miffed....I dreadhaving an engine stall. When I first got the thing I couldn't start it at all...There was a gremlin which fixed itself. I'm very disapointed however once it's running it's great and very economical. I think the carb needs to be finely tuned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybluerob Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 Hisorry to bring this post back up again I now have the problem with the pulley system mostly sorted out. (It is not as good as the Bailey frame , but good enough) I have no problems anymore with starting the engine from cold, with the engine on my back. I still sometimes have a problem when starting it once the engine is warm. What happens is, when I pull it feels like the engine fires and then rip the pull chord back, and then stops, this will then keep on happening and I then have to start it on the ground. Has someone experieced this problem? or know what might be the cause? Other than this problem, I'm very happy with the Bailey engine and would buy one again. I have the very same symptoms. Most of the time I have to get a mate to try and start the thing but even then they have problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybluerob Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 Hi I can not comment on the Zenith set up, but every Bailey V5 owner i know and have sold too have no issue restarting while in the air. Even the one's with Baboon arms Firstly i would suggest going back to your dealer and get a hang check just to make sure the geometry is correct if you can not find the Pull cord. Also You say it takes 5-6 pulls to restart??? What carb do you have PWK or the New CVK? The PWK can be a bit of a pig. I regularly switch of while thermaling and ridge soaring and have not had an issue with the new CVK. My PWK carb V5 Had two starting procedures depending on how long i was turn off for. If i was thermalling at height and for a long time 45m 1h30m and the motor would get very cold and i would have to use the primer bulb switch on the choke. I also had to crack the throttle open a tad then pull start... Basically the same as you would on your back while warming it up. The other way was to just crack the throttle open a little no choke and pull. The CVK is similar while cold on the ground But with no choke. Prime until the bulb goes hard. Very cold conditions 5-6 pumps on the throttle then pull the pull start cord. It may fire once then stop. This is normal try again. As there is no choke it will need little pumps on the throttle to maintain rev's and to stop it from cutting out... Normal operating temps... Primer bulb until it goes solid. A couple of pumps on the throttle crack the throttle a tad 1/4 throttle then pull start. Again you may need to gentle pump on the throttle until it has warmed slightly... Again this is because there is no choke and uses a primer pump on the side of the carb. The pull start should be almost touching the back of your head while seated in the machine. On a Bailey V5. Basically go back to your dealer to fit you into the harness correctly and to show you the starting. Get the carb upgrade if you do have the PWK. hope this helps Mark http://www.sussexparamotors.co.uk Mark Remember me? Rob?I met you on the service station to take the V5. I bought the V5 off you in August 2012 and had a problem starting the thing from new. Remember me phoning and texting you with the problem? You say you don't know of any people you've sold these to that have had problems!!! Mine has been terrible for starting...easy start my arse!!...and it isn't due to bad technique as you suggested!! I need it sorting.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybluerob Posted February 10, 2013 Share Posted February 10, 2013 Hisorry to bring this post back up again I now have the problem with the pulley system mostly sorted out. (It is not as good as the Bailey frame , but good enough) I have no problems anymore with starting the engine from cold, with the engine on my back. I still sometimes have a problem when starting it once the engine is warm. What happens is, when I pull it feels like the engine fires and then rip the pull chord back, and then stops, this will then keep on happening and I then have to start it on the ground. Has someone experieced this problem? or know what might be the cause? Other than this problem, I'm very happy with the Bailey engine and would buy one again. Jaco Don't let anyone make you feel that it is you that is doing something wrong.... The person that sold me my V5 (and owns one too) attempted to demonstrate starting my new V5. He couldn't get it to start on his back!!! In heinsight, I should have refused to take it at that time but I had already paid for it. The only way to solve our problem would be for Bailey to take the units off us and return them functioning how they should..!!...There's not a cat in hells chance of that happening. I have been in touch with Bailey on another subject (claiming their props are 'carbon composite' when in fact they are a thin shell of carbon fibre and core of glass fibre); I don't want to get into that right now. I wasn't happy with that outcome..!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Ref Props. You will not find any paramotor manufacturer using a 100% carbon prop. The carbon layer is there for cosmetic reasons more than anything else, backed up with e-glass and then filled with a polyurethane foam. (if your lucky you may find a thin honeycomb layer inside which adds a massive amount of strength) This is very normal manufacturing technique for carbon parts that are hollow. For a prop to be 100% carbon (even if left hollow) you could expect the price to tripple at least) The biggest problem I have with Paramotor props is that they all tend to be made using cheep Polyester resins and not epoxy which is way better suited to carbon. In a nut shell, you won't find a prop made of 100% carbon I hope this helps to ease your distress on that particular point. SW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybluerob Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Cheers Simon Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoolw Posted February 11, 2013 Author Share Posted February 11, 2013 Hi I can not comment on the Zenith set up, but every Bailey V5 owner i know and have sold too have no issue restarting while in the air. Even the one's with Baboon arms Firstly i would suggest going back to your dealer and get a hang check just to make sure the geometry is correct if you can not find the Pull cord. Also You say it takes 5-6 pulls to restart??? What carb do you have PWK or the New CVK? The PWK can be a bit of a pig. I regularly switch of while thermaling and ridge soaring and have not had an issue with the new CVK. My PWK carb V5 Had two starting procedures depending on how long i was turn off for. If i was thermalling at height and for a long time 45m 1h30m and the motor would get very cold and i would have to use the primer bulb switch on the choke. I also had to crack the throttle open a tad then pull start... Basically the same as you would on your back while warming it up. The other way was to just crack the throttle open a little no choke and pull. The CVK is similar while cold on the ground But with no choke. Prime until the bulb goes hard. Very cold conditions 5-6 pumps on the throttle then pull the pull start cord. It may fire once then stop. This is normal try again. As there is no choke it will need little pumps on the throttle to maintain rev's and to stop it from cutting out... Normal operating temps... Primer bulb until it goes solid. A couple of pumps on the throttle crack the throttle a tad 1/4 throttle then pull start. Again you may need to gentle pump on the throttle until it has warmed slightly... Again this is because there is no choke and uses a primer pump on the side of the carb. The pull start should be almost touching the back of your head while seated in the machine. On a Bailey V5. Basically go back to your dealer to fit you into the harness correctly and to show you the starting. Get the carb upgrade if you do have the PWK. hope this helps Mark http://www.sussexparamotors.co.uk Mark Remember me? Rob?I met you on the service station to take the V5. I bought the V5 off you in August 2012 and had a problem starting the thing from new. Remember me phoning and texting you with the problem? You say you don't know of any people you've sold these to that have had problems!!! Mine has been terrible for starting...easy start my arse!!...and it isn't due to bad technique as you suggested!! I need it sorting.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notch Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 I hate to say this again but , a four stroke is hard to start by hand when warm. Just come to a track day at the local motorcross park, and hear all the cursing from those guys riding 4 strokes (that don't have electric start). These bikes are well sorted, but still difficult to start when warm. I think it just goes with the territory, part of the joy of owning one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgy Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Hi I can not comment on the Zenith set up, but every Bailey V5 owner i know and have sold too have no issue restarting while in the air. Even the one's with Baboon arms Firstly i would suggest going back to your dealer and get a hang check just to make sure the geometry is correct if you can not find the Pull cord. Also You say it takes 5-6 pulls to restart??? What carb do you have PWK or the New CVK? The PWK can be a bit of a pig. I regularly switch of while thermaling and ridge soaring and have not had an issue with the new CVK. My PWK carb V5 Had two starting procedures depending on how long i was turn off for. If i was thermalling at height and for a long time 45m 1h30m and the motor would get very cold and i would have to use the primer bulb switch on the choke. I also had to crack the throttle open a tad then pull start... Basically the same as you would on your back while warming it up. The other way was to just crack the throttle open a little no choke and pull. The CVK is similar while cold on the ground But with no choke. Prime until the bulb goes hard. Very cold conditions 5-6 pumps on the throttle then pull the pull start cord. It may fire once then stop. This is normal try again. As there is no choke it will need little pumps on the throttle to maintain rev's and to stop it from cutting out... Normal operating temps... Primer bulb until it goes solid. A couple of pumps on the throttle crack the throttle a tad 1/4 throttle then pull start. Again you may need to gentle pump on the throttle until it has warmed slightly... Again this is because there is no choke and uses a primer pump on the side of the carb. The pull start should be almost touching the back of your head while seated in the machine. On a Bailey V5. Basically go back to your dealer to fit you into the harness correctly and to show you the starting. Get the carb upgrade if you do have the PWK. hope this helps Mark http://www.sussexparamotors.co.uk Mark Remember me? Rob?I met you on the service station to take the V5. I bought the V5 off you in August 2012 and had a problem starting the thing from new. Remember me phoning and texting you with the problem? You say you don't know of any people you've sold these to that have had problems!!! Mine has been terrible for starting...easy start my arse!!...and it isn't due to bad technique as you suggested!! I need it sorting.... Hi Rob Sorry i do not remember meeting anyone at a service station in august and our till system does not show any V5 sales in august?? whats your second name?? Not saying you didn't buy from us my memory is carp at best... I am not sure what your trying to say but i would not let a V5 leave my place with a customer not being able to start it... you are obviously not happy with your V5 If you have an issue with a motor you bought from us why have you not been back in contact with me again?? What Carb do you have PWK My guess... my mobile is 07867317307 please call me if you have an issue or bring it down or ship it to us for me too lok at. As for the carbon Prop simon is correct... you can buy a standard black prop for the same price!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgy Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Jacoolw How was it you went from not being able to start it at all to now being able to start it fine cold?? My guess now you seen how its done and also its run in a little more as first Posted by myself this is the same with the warm starting.. The warm starting. You do not need to pump the throttle (like cold start) just crack the throttle half take it past the compression and one long pull should do it. If it does not fire after a couple of attempts it could be when you getting up your leaning over and to the left to much and slightly flooding the motor. Try to get up and lean to the right... To clear it open the throttle fully and keep open while pulling over the motor at least four times... then try again but with the throttle open it should fire and be a bit lumpy... If this is the case your flooding the motor. If not it could be you need to give a couple of pumps. I was never saying its your fault!!!! just trying to suggest the correct way of starting it to you as you had not been shown by your dealer.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybluerob Posted February 11, 2013 Share Posted February 11, 2013 Mark I'm very very exyremely sorry....I've just found an old Email from the person I bought it off. Sabre ace..? You'll probably know him. Thankyou for being helpful but I just think that four strokes are inherrently difficult to start. My V5 starts best without choke when cold. When warm, it sort of backfires and pops and will never start from the harness. A friend or passerby may start it eventually. This indicates that it is running rich. All is still as from new. I like the power, sound, quality and build and if I could get it to start more effectively I'd be well happy. I have tricepts like Schwarzneger from the 80s and use a setup that has a rope pull on a pully in the gym and load it up. Believe my I'm no whimp. Again, I'm profusely sorry I wrongly pointed my finger at you....(made myself look a right tit now ;0) Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoolw Posted February 12, 2013 Author Share Posted February 12, 2013 sorry, Morgy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgy Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Hi Rob No problem... I did think when you said you met me at a service station THIS CAN'T be correct. (very unprofessional) I spend at least an hour with my customers going over very thing from set up to minor servicing and i make sure they can start it!!! Rob if you are having an issue with your machine your more than welcome to come down and visit us and we can see if we can sort it for you and may be go for a fly.. It might be worth you getting the CVK carb upgrade. Four strokes are not hard to start at all most issues are user error. Its the same as a two stroke they have little sequences you have to go through. Also Please remember this is a public forum. Make sure you have your facts before shooting from the hip!!! Regards Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybluerob Posted February 12, 2013 Share Posted February 12, 2013 Yeah, I'd really like to go flying with ya...or anyone in fact. This is something I'm looking forward to doing. Your spot is a bit far away though. I'm planning on driving to Spain with my kit in August and may see ya en-route. The V5 should be sorted by then...hopefully. You are absolutely right regarding shooting from the hip and I hope it is me that looks a tit rather than any mark against you. We're going to get some decent weather soon...I can feel it...!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoolw Posted February 12, 2013 Author Share Posted February 12, 2013 Hi Skybluerob It looks like we have the same problem, is there any chance that you can get your motor to Baileyn to have a look at. Hopefully I can then apply the same fix to my motor. I'm in New Zealand. cheers, Jaco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacoolw Posted February 12, 2013 Author Share Posted February 12, 2013 Hisorry to bring this post back up again I now have the problem with the pulley system mostly sorted out. (It is not as good as the Bailey frame , but good enough) I have no problems anymore with starting the engine from cold, with the engine on my back. I still sometimes have a problem when starting it once the engine is warm. What happens is, when I pull it feels like the engine fires and then rip the pull chord back, and then stops, this will then keep on happening and I then have to start it on the ground. Has someone experieced this problem? or know what might be the cause? Other than this problem, I'm very happy with the Bailey engine and would buy one again. I have the very same symptoms. Most of the time I have to get a mate to try and start the thing but even then they have problems. Could this be the pull start assembly? Skybluerob, do you also have to use two hands to pull start? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgy Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Hi Jacoolw MY guess is that you both have Different carb's. The Pwk did give some of my customers issues and some never had any. Most were a hick up or miss. The starting was also different to the CVK carb... I have not met another V5 owner who has to use Both hands to start it... I personally think its down to the geometry of the P jet Pull start. I am going to the factory on monday as we have just become a dealer for P jet. I will see if i can try one on and let you know. Did you say it felt tighter when it was hot ?? or that it just would not start?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skybluerob Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Morgy Thankyou very much for being involved with Jaco and my V5 issue. I don't need to use both hands on the pulley rope as I have developed my tricepts. The pulley is attached to the prop guard and this distorts with every pull and the rope is becoming worn due to the unsuccessful starts. I think it would be impractical to have my unit posted to and from Bailey. I'd like to try this other type of carb though. Where can I buy one from? Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
morgy Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Hi Rob Bailey will fit the new carb upgrade kit. Its £120, at least it was last time we had one done.. If its closer for you you can come to us and we can order the parts in for you and fit them while you wait... I would strongly suggest you go to Bailey if there is a problem Paul is always very interested in any issue any customer has. But my guess is that its down to the carb or incorrect starting... Have you checked the Jets?? If you wish you could drop of your V5 here for us to have a look at . If it is the PWK carb at fault it would be replaced free of charge. But as above it's £120 for the CVK kit. My number is 07867317307 Regards Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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