LEG STRAPS!!!

[tj]

Or, to quote the RAF, "Be Alert, we're short of Lerts in this county."

[dantheman]

Some bad news just out HERE, and while not related on the Long Mynd PG forum they mentioned an accidental reserve deployment recently that resulted in a ride in the air ambulance, keep on your toes guys

[carvingair]

That is of course assuming you are lucky enough to have arms!

Think of the poor high hang pointers in this case!

SW

Over the shoulder floating J-bars (high as they get?) lifts the weight of the motor (off your back) soon as the wing is up. This makes it easy to notice right away and throttle down before you slide out of the harness because it would just leave you there and fly away. It's so benign you can turn around and drop the wing for a reverse inflation after hooking up all 3 straps!

That was my take on it anyway, I fly the low ones now but prefer the high ones in low variable wind take offs.

Another Canadian perspective

Ciao,

Marko:D

[Guest]

my thoughts too , i cant see the big deal i have seen it happen on low hang points and he killed engine sat down laughed and strapped in and off he went. only see it a prob if jumpin off a ridge or somethin like

[cageuk]

I would guess that on a flat launch, most of the time it would be a non event as long as the launch has been aborted in good time. I shudder to think though what would happen if the wing has started to launch leaving the pilot behind, the pilot comes off of the power and the motor comes down on top of him.

I don't know if physically this could happen but I can't think of a reason why not! Sod's law will normally ensure the worse.

Also, hills are not the sole domain of PG'ers and PPGs do sometimes use hills and gradients to launch. Whatever the circumstances leg straps should be a part of your preflight checks after all it takes seconds to check so is no hardship.

Just my humble opinion.

Cheers

Mark

[pete_b]

I would guess that on a flat launch, most of the time it would be a non event as long as the launch has been aborted in good time. I shudder to think though what would happen if the wing has started to launch leaving the pilot behind, the pilot comes off of the power and the motor comes down on top of him.

I don't know if physically this could happen but I can't think of a reason why not! Sod's law will normally ensure the worse.

Also, hills are not the sole domain of PG'ers and PPGs do sometimes use hills and gradients to launch. Whatever the circumstances leg straps should be a part of your preflight checks after all it takes seconds to check so is no hardship.

Just my humble opinion.

Cheers

Mark

Leg straps should be done up first and the last thing you check prior to take off run.

[Guest]

i know it aint really relevant as i guess all do check and check again, but assuming one didnt strap in on a low hang point system, i dont think it would be easy to slip out, the arms of the machine would raise untill under ya arm pits and still lift ya, unless you put both arms directly up in the air, which when launching we do not do.

so i think ya wouls still get a flight, just a little bit more interesting

so assuming ya kept ya arms horizontal or facing down then i cant think how you would fall out and prob live to tell the story

[pete_b]

i know it aint really relevant as i guess all do check and check again, but assuming one didnt strap in on a low hang point system, i dont think it would be easy to slip out, the arms of the machine would raise untill under ya arm pits and still lift ya, unless you put both arms directly up in the air, which when launching we do not do.

so i think ya wouls still get a flight, just a little bit more interesting

so assuming ya kept ya arms horizontal or facing down then i cant think how you would fall out and prob live to tell the story

And how are you going to use the brakes for steering/flare ect

DO THEM UP no excuses PRE FLIGHT CHECK

[asquaddie]

I think everybody reading this thread WILL CHECK THEIR LEG STRAPS more than twice for a while

[pete_b]

I think everybody reading this thread WILL CHECK THEIR LEG STRAPS more than twice for a while

Im hearing an echo, [Fixed Pete, you must have been listening through your wonky listening horn - N ]

sorry wrong thread,should be under the ear defenders thread

[Guest]

well from the low hang points there is only maybe ten inch before the bars are under your arms so ya may fly with a little bit of brake on, keep ya arm in an l shame i cant see a problem , i think everyone does do there leg straps up but its good to work out ways of dealing with it if they wasnt done up

[Phil_P]

Just a thought here;

Anyone who thinks dangling by your arm pits and flying a paramotor is a workable deal, I think you might want to reconsider. Given that you are unlikely to end up with the bar tucked neatly in the 'pit' of your armpit, much more likely to have it pressing into somewhere along your upper arm. Now imagine your whole body weight suspended from that.

Apart from anything else, massive muscle tensions are created in your chest, which greatly resticts your ability to breathe, exactly at the moment when a surge of adrenalin is yelling at your body to breathe like mad. This alone can create a feeling of utter panic in most people, with the exception of those who have exceptional training. Doing the right things at a moment like this becomes a complete lottery, not least the almost reflex action of clenching your fists (fight or flight) and remember where your throttle grip is.

I for one have taken off with one leg strap undone, when I aborted a landing and was about to get out my harness until someone came to assist me. By that time, one of my legs was undone (can't remember if the chest was). When I took off and realised, even THAT amount of panic was quite butt clenching and uncontrollable.

Build your leg straps into a pattern of checks, always follow that pattern. If the pattern is interrupted, start again. Do NOT let the pattern become so routine you become complacent.

I now have a pre-flight pattern of '6' checks, and an essential actions pattern of 'six' checks. As I check the items, I physically touch them and count out loud. If for some reason I don't get to '6' I start again.

Thoughts of Grandmothers and egg-sucking come to mind here, so please forgive, and try to consider it as reinforcement for something you already do impeccably

Phil

[cageuk]

Also, the weight of your body will restrict the flow of blood to your arms. It wouldn't take very long before your arms, fatiqued and denied a full blood supply along with your own adrenaline drained body would give up.

If it were easy to do, then many pilots who have found themselves in this situation would not have died in a truly horrifying manner.

Leg strap checks are easy, recoverying from untied leg straps is virtually impossible on a PPG. I know what I would choose!

Cheers

Mark

[norman]

I get the funniest looks from other pilots when PPG or free flying because I go through everything in a set routine every time. Even when ground handling.

I do a preflight exactly the same way I do for a fixed wing aircraft. I start at 1 wingtip and work my way around 360 degrees back to the same wing tip checking every line, cell, maillon, nut and bolt, straps etc etc. You get the picture.

Glenn,

You use a tried and tested set of habits. They do work don't they? Who gives a toss what anyone thinks.

[Guest]

too true no need not to do them up. but people do forget things, so i always think of some plan if the silliest and worst happen, its good all comin sayin ohh just do your pre flight checks, but we all know that it is left out sometimes, so i was throwing ideas around in the event something like this happened, plan b if you like.

[norman]

I think the central point here is HABITS leoib. I can count on a couple of hands the number of times my bacon has been saved by developed habits. It is spooky when it happens - I suppose that is why I bang on about them.

As has been illustrated here, there doesn't seem to be a Plan B if you leave your leg straps undone. Your arms go dead and you follow them unless you are a courageous contortionist.

[shaggydec]

Very early on in my flying experience i had tightened my leg and chest straps TOO tight.... Plus because it was cold i had full winter gear on which restricted movement . I had done 2 flights already and the wind had dropped which meant running with a forward launch .

To be honest i was completely shattered and should have called it a day,but you know how it feels when conditions are perfect....

I had a few failed launches but persevered , by this time wet through with sweat and gasping for a drink . I eventually managed to get up , but as i tried to wiggle into the seat i realised the board had gone right flat with my back , and because i was strapped in so tight nothing would budge

Got some height and clipped up the brakes so my left hand was free to push into seat , but by this time my stomach muscles were in spasm and could nt believe how much strength id lost . There was no way of getting comfy and i could feel myself starting to black out.

As Phil P says your breathing is very much restricted , so i hung on for life and did a gentle circle before coming in to land.

I couldnt even run and just fell flat on my stomach...I had to lie there a good few minutes before blood got to where it was needed !!!

My lesson learned from this is make sure your straps are fastened but not too tight..make sure you can slide your hand underneath...and make sure that your seat board slides into position without the need to use your hands...and DONT FLY WHEN YOURE KNACKERED !!

[shaggydec]

And another thing !!

Why dont manufacturers make the straps a different colour ? Theres nowt worse than trying to peer between your legs for the correct clip for the correct strap..and invariably the end of one is tucked up behind your arse ( or is it just me ?

LILAC...LEFT

RED....RIGHT

Oh must be just me then !!!

[slapper]

Diligence saves lives and bent metal doesn't it?

I love the calm approach with a recognition that distractions can disrupt your flight preparation. Good habits will save you time but more importantly catch the things you might have missed. Picking up something at the last minute that might have caused you problems later won't always be chance - Training applies the focus you need and develops all of the above.

Sorry if I am peeing you off with 'worldly advise' here but the parallels with other forms of aviation stick out like a dogs doo-

. No-one can turn the clock back by even a microsecond ...

Good bedtime reading, prob won't sleep now.

Veteran of 5000+ parachute jumps, final checks 2nd nature (don't be distracted)

[edwardc]

Also, you have to have a 'flight line' check when skydiving by someone else, not a bad idea!!!

Eddie

[mike1714]

Shaggy............................I agree with you, why dont they have different colours for different leg straps............................I am always getting my starps in a twist!!!!!!

MIke

[tommcb6016]

I was speaking to my dad this morning and he used to do alot of hangliding, he knew a bloke who jumped of a big hill with out doing up his harness not a good day out !

When I am all sorted for kit I was thinking about laminating a small card with a preflight checklist on and fixing it to my harness.

Tom