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Advance Epsilon 5, Confirm?


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Hi

Please can someone experienced back me up that my wing and motor combo is safe?

I use an Advance Epsilon 5 for free flight and will be using this same wing for paramotoring with a PAP 1100as.

The weight range for free flight is 75kg to 106kg, my naked weight is 84kg so my 'all up flying weight' is quite near the top of the range when free flying.

The DULV have certified this wing up to 146kg for paramotoring. My PAP must weigh about 20kg dry I think? It hold 8.5 litre of fuel when full but I'm not sure how much weigh this adds - about 5kg maybe? That would make my all up paramotoring weight approx 130kg (or less) which I 'think' I'm happy with!

Anybody fancy swapping or part exchanging this wing for a nice reflex wing? Logged 85 hours with no damage, rips or repairs.

Cheers, Joe.

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Although the DULV cert is up to 146 the manufacturer claims it is designed for up to 166 kg. So definitely strong enough for your AUW.

The Epsilon 5 is a superb thermaller and I would be in no hurry to trade her in until I was absolutely sure I didnt want or need the 8.6:1 glide any more!!

Once you have attained the same skill levels in PPG as you have in PG you will be in a better place to judge perhaps?

Also "reflex" is not any particular wing, rather a design and aerofoil concept. Which particular "reflex" wing are you considering in exchange for one of the best designed, widely appreciated and superbly built wings on the market?

Perhaps the new paramania Fusion will be as good in the lift and on a glide?

If I can blague one for my forthcoming week (10 days) in the Dolomites I will let you know :wink:

I already have a motor and a trike sorted (thanks Pietro)

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Although the DULV cert is up to 146 the manufacturer claims it is designed for up to 166 kg. So definitely strong enough for your AUW.

The Epsilon 5 is a superb thermaller and I would be in no hurry to trade her in until I was absolutely sure I didnt want or need the 8.6:1 glide any more!!

Once you have attained the same skill levels in PPG as you have in PG you will be in a better place to judge perhaps?

Also "reflex" is not any particular wing, rather a design and aerofoil concept. Which particular "reflex" wing are you considering in exchange for one of the best designed, widely appreciated and superbly built wings on the market?

Perhaps the new paramania Fusion will be as good in the lift and on a glide?

If I can blague one for my forthcoming week (10 days) in the Dolomites I will let you know :wink:

I already have a motor and a trike sorted (thanks Pietro)

You're right, I should spend more time at ppg with this great wing before deciding if I want to go for a reflex 'style' wing. Would be nice if I could afford a pg and a reflex wing but whilst I can afford only one for both disciplines I'd be as well to keep the Epsilon. I know you can get paramotors risers with trimmers for this wing, they might make it fly quicker for ppg without having to be on the speedbar full time.

Cheers

Joe

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That is an interesting riser set Joe.

I have not seen that idea before. They have included another hook in point to shorten the riser set without having to adjust the brake lengths for high hang points. I would like to know if they recommend the lower hook in for swinging aem machines such as your PAP.

Ask the question when you buy them and let us know. (be sure if you buy from a dealer that they actually ask Advance not just say what they think).

E5_Motortragegurte_02.jpg

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That is an interesting riser set Joe.

I have not seen that idea before. They have included another hook in point to shorten the riser set without having to adjust the brake lengths for high hang points. I would like to know if they recommend the lower hook in for swinging aem machines such as your PAP.

Ask the question when you buy them and let us know. (be sure if you buy from a dealer that they actually ask Advance not just say what they think).

E5_Motortragegurte_02.jpg

my friends apco thrust hp has the same dual hook in points - my revolution hasnt though!

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That is an interesting riser set Joe.

I have not seen that idea before. They have included another hook in point to shorten the riser set without having to adjust the brake lengths for high hang points. I would like to know if they recommend the lower hook in for swinging aem machines such as your PAP.

Ask the question when you buy them and let us know. (be sure if you buy from a dealer that they actually ask Advance not just say what they think).

E5_Motortragegurte_02.jpg

my friends apco thrust hp has the same dual hook in points - my revolution hasnt though!

as does my sting powerplay.

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Hi

Please can someone experienced back me up that my wing and motor combo is safe?

I use an Advance Epsilon 5 for free flight and will be using this same wing for paramotoring with a PAP 1100as.

The weight range for free flight is 75kg to 106kg, my naked weight is 84kg so my 'all up flying weight' is quite near the top of the range when free flying.

The DULV have certified this wing up to 146kg for paramotoring. My PAP must weigh about 20kg dry I think? It hold 8.5 litre of fuel when full but I'm not sure how much weigh this adds - about 5kg maybe? That would make my all up paramotoring weight approx 130kg (or less) which I 'think' I'm happy with!

Anybody fancy swapping or part exchanging this wing for a nice reflex wing? Logged 85 hours with no damage, rips or repairs.

Cheers, Joe.

I have the same motor as you but am 76kg, wearing my boots and helmet and with a have tank of fuel my clip in wieght was 110kg ad another 10kg for fuel and instruments puts it around 120kg so you may be closer to 140kg.

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Hi I have the same wing, an Epsilon 5 28 with Paramotor risers. I am around 82 Kgs.

To Paraglide you just slip the trimmers over the carrabiner clip in point and the trimmers are non moveable and the DHV1-2 rating is still there. Once the trimmers are slipped out for Paragliding, the DHV rating is lost. However in my experience it does not change the flight experience at all. Actually the speed range with the trimmers fully out is only a few miles per hour faster than the normal paragliding mode.

Also the big difference between this wing and a reflex is the glide. In real use, it just floats on landings and you have to watch how far it might go. All the reflex wings I have flown (3 of them) come in at a much faster and steeper angle and bleed off the speed before touch down. I love the way it handles and takes off. Its just that it wont keep up with a reflex for top speed. Also it must use less fuel.

Well thats my thoughts on the wing!

Cheers

Mikey

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Francis777 - Good point about using these risers in paramotor mode with a low hang point machine, this would probably put my brake handles uncomfortably low as they are in a good position just now.

After reading other replies on here with regards to reflex wings I am just going to keep the Epsilon for the foreseeable future. Good glide ratio and gentle landings prob make up for the lower speed compared to a reflex. Plus I'd miss having it for free flight.

Outkast, how are you finding your PAP 1100? Have you had many problems with it? I've had 3 flights on mine but have always been a bit unsure about the small amount of play on my swingarms. Just bought the new model arms so that should restore some in-flight faith! Does your model have the fuel tank above the engine like mine? I think mines is a really old model but has only been flown about 50 hours, just had a recent overhaul and runs sweet! I'm 84kg and it still scoops me off the ground fairly easy.

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Francis777 - Good point about using these risers in paramotor mode with a low hang point machine, this would probably put my brake handles uncomfortably low as they are in a good position just now.

After reading other replies on here with regards to reflex wings I am just going to keep the Epsilon for the foreseeable future. Good glide ratio and gentle landings prob make up for the lower speed compared to a reflex. Plus I'd miss having it for free flight.

Outkast, how are you finding your PAP 1100? Have you had many problems with it? I've had 3 flights on mine but have always been a bit unsure about the small amount of play on my swingarms. Just bought the new model arms so that should restore some in-flight faith! Does your model have the fuel tank above the engine like mine? I think mines is a really old model but has only been flown about 50 hours, just had a recent overhaul and runs sweet! I'm 84kg and it still scoops me off the ground fairly easy.

Hi, I have not flown my pap yet, yes its got the fuel tank above with the engine inverted, I have had a few problems, the decompressor hole must be blocked as it is hard to crank over, I have got a new head gasket recently so will sort this soon, as it was hard to crank over i broke the pull cord and have just replaced that, also ordered a carb rebiuld kit as I think the carb needs stripping and cleaning out, as soon as i get time to do the above I shall be getting airbourne, if I can get it done in the week and the weather is good next weekend i shall be ready for take off :lol:

Have you got the 4 blade prop or 2 blade?

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Francis777 - Good point about using these risers in paramotor mode with a low hang point machine, this would probably put my brake handles uncomfortably low as they are in a good position just now.

After reading other replies on here with regards to reflex wings I am just going to keep the Epsilon for the foreseeable future. Good glide ratio and gentle landings prob make up for the lower speed compared to a reflex. Plus I'd miss having it for free flight.

Outkast, how are you finding your PAP 1100? Have you had many problems with it? I've had 3 flights on mine but have always been a bit unsure about the small amount of play on my swingarms. Just bought the new model arms so that should restore some in-flight faith! Does your model have the fuel tank above the engine like mine? I think mines is a really old model but has only been flown about 50 hours, just had a recent overhaul and runs sweet! I'm 84kg and it still scoops me off the ground fairly easy.

Hi, I have not flown my pap yet, yes its got the fuel tank above with the engine inverted, I have had a few problems, the decompressor hole must be blocked as it is hard to crank over, I have got a new head gasket recently so will sort this soon, as it was hard to crank over i broke the pull cord and have just replaced that, also ordered a carb rebiuld kit as I think the carb needs stripping and cleaning out, as soon as i get time to do the above I shall be getting airbourne, if I can get it done in the week and the weather is good next weekend i shall be ready for take off :lol:

Have you got the 4 blade prop or 2 blade?

I've got a brand new 2 blade wooden prop that the previous owner put on. Think he damaged the original 4 blade and the replacement is really expensive....if you can find one. Do you know if you can get carbon props for them?

I'm lucky coz the previous owner rebulit his tilloston carb before selling it to me. If you get stuck with the rebuild give me a shout as the previous owner said he is really experienced with them. He would possibly do the rebuild for you for a very small fee if you ran into problems. I'm sure there will be rebuild guides online though.

Have you decoked it? My solo 210 seems quite easy to start. The previous owners was a qualified mechanic and attributes this to the fact that he has managed to get the coil and flywheel very close together, almost touching but not touching! Starts on 2nd or 3rd pull 99% of the time. Have you got the solo 210 manual? It states that the gap between coil and flywheel should be 0.2mm so could be worth checking that if it still doesnt fire?

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I understand there is a kit to fit the solo 210 with a more powerful ignition? Magneto ignitions always are weak. My PAP used to start OK from cold but hot it was difficult. Maybe that was to do with the coil/flywheel gap expanding on a hot engine? I didnt realise it was so critical.

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I understand there is a kit to fit the solo 210 with a more powerful ignition? Magneto ignitions always are weak. My PAP used to start OK from cold but hot it was difficult. Maybe that was to do with the coil/flywheel gap expanding on a hot engine? I didnt realise it was so critical.

Yeah you can get the High Energy Ignition System for it. My PAP starts a bit easier when cold as well. Don't think it's down to the coil and flywheel gap expanding - surely the gap would decrease in distance as metal warms and expands? Maybe if the gap is too small when cold it fires easily then when the engine is warm the gap is closed due to thermal expansion...... so the flywheel and coil actually touch - creating resistance thus difficult to turn over?

I don't know enough about the finer working details of engines so forgive me if I'm talking s**t!

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Francis777 - Good point about using these risers in paramotor mode with a low hang point machine, this would probably put my brake handles uncomfortably low as they are in a good position just now.

After reading other replies on here with regards to reflex wings I am just going to keep the Epsilon for the foreseeable future. Good glide ratio and gentle landings prob make up for the lower speed compared to a reflex. Plus I'd miss having it for free flight.

Outkast, how are you finding your PAP 1100? Have you had many problems with it? I've had 3 flights on mine but have always been a bit unsure about the small amount of play on my swingarms. Just bought the new model arms so that should restore some in-flight faith! Does your model have the fuel tank above the engine like mine? I think mines is a really old model but has only been flown about 50 hours, just had a recent overhaul and runs sweet! I'm 84kg and it still scoops me off the ground fairly easy.

Hi, I have not flown my pap yet, yes its got the fuel tank above with the engine inverted, I have had a few problems, the decompressor hole must be blocked as it is hard to crank over, I have got a new head gasket recently so will sort this soon, as it was hard to crank over i broke the pull cord and have just replaced that, also ordered a carb rebiuld kit as I think the carb needs stripping and cleaning out, as soon as i get time to do the above I shall be getting airbourne, if I can get it done in the week and the weather is good next weekend i shall be ready for take off :lol:

Have you got the 4 blade prop or 2 blade?

I've got a brand new 2 blade wooden prop that the previous owner put on. Think he damaged the original 4 blade and the replacement is really expensive....if you can find one. Do you know if you can get carbon props for them?

I'm lucky coz the previous owner rebulit his tilloston carb before selling it to me. If you get stuck with the rebuild give me a shout as the previous owner said he is really experienced with them. He would possibly do the rebuild for you for a very small fee if you ran into problems. I'm sure there will be rebuild guides online though.

Have you decoked it? My solo 210 seems quite easy to start. The previous owners was a qualified mechanic and attributes this to the fact that he has managed to get the coil and flywheel very close together, almost touching but not touching! Starts on 2nd or 3rd pull 99% of the time. Have you got the solo 210 manual? It states that the gap between coil and flywheel should be 0.2mm so could be worth checking that if it still doesnt fire?

I would be interested in him doing the work for me if he is really experienced with them, where is he located?

the high energy ignition is worth fitting as it gives you inflight charging too, and you can keep your pull start as a back up, its not cheap though, see below:

http://www.k48.com/solo.htm

cheers, Dave.

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i used these people you mention but to be honest they had my motor for 2 month and it came back as bad as it went 690 pounds later i would fit it all my self if i had to again the guy aint a clue what he is doing i had to get an electrician to come sort the wiring it was all done wrong so be aware have deep pockets and be prepared for a wait

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i used these people you mention but to be honest they had my motor for 2 month and it came back as bad as it went 690 pounds later i would fit it all my self if i had to again the guy aint a clue what he is doing i had to get an electrician to come sort the wiring it was all done wrong so be aware have deep pockets and be prepared for a wait

If I can get it to start as easily as Fuels then I wont bother with the ignition.

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Outkast, I just noticed the guy who serviced the tilloston carb on my PAP before I bought it is actually registered on here, under the name 'skyhawk'. If you find him you could PM him and ask his advice. I'm sure he would let you post everything up (Scotland) and rebuild the carb for you at minimal cost. You could also ask him about the flywheel and coil thing, he prob used a feeler gauge to get them so close together. If you can't get in touch with him then let me know and I will speak with him as I still have his contact details.

I don't think you need the HEIS either if you get the engine set up as good as mines. Best saving the money toward a better paramotor.....not that the 1100 is bad but I'd love a Volution one day!

Cheers, Joe

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  • 1 month later...

I fly an Epsilon 4 and retrofitted it with the E5 paramotor risers.

As was said, the trimmers are intended to fly PG free flying disabled and hooked through your biner.

They can be flown free or motor in either hang point and the only benefit of either is to make adjustment for variation in hang height.

In my experience they are equivalent to speed bar in speed increase, they simply act back to front versus front to back with regard to AOA adjustment. The effect is the same.

They were surprisingly cheap and worthwhile purchase, although they did not come with a pullied and thumb looped split A as the E4 risers had. Miss that a bit when grabbing ears.

They were 100 Euro from Advance.

I was concerned they may have been tailored for the E5 specifically, which is a different breed of glider then the E4 so asked advance about AOA @ trim variation, to which they said:

"

The motor riser don’t changes the AOA in neutral/no trimm.

The paramotor risers are specially made for the EPSILON 5 - they're not tested for the

EPSILON 4 or any other model.

Unfortunately we don’t have more informations to share.

In general, the EPSILON 4 is a more dynamic glider then the EPSILON 5 – so we think, that also his reactions when flown with open trimmers will be more dynamic then those of the EPSILON 5

."

Edit: I am 100kg, my kit all up and full 14l wet is 50kgish (homebuilt RR clone) so I'm 20kg over on my E4 31. It flies hot anyway, but trim speed is about 40k and I've seen 55 on full trimmer when full (GPS) with this wing loading. I can cruise for 3.5 hours though ignoring thermals and enjoying the view on cruise. Check manufacturer specs on fuel burn @ rpm - on the mini2 it's roughly 2.2 l/hr @ 5500rpm. Every kit's different but I recommend the E5 pmotor risers regardless.

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  • 2 years later...

I flew mine on your number 2 position for both free flying and motor flying. (low hangpoint motor)

You can fly either position, depending only on how your hangpoints are set up on your motor.

Higher hangpoints may put your brakes out of reach, so using a higher point on the risers can compensate (a bit).

Try both while kiting to know for sure.

The trimmer adjustment strap is intended to be (pulled to full slow, then) folded underneath the bottom of the risers (before clipping into biners) for free flying. This effectively locks the rear adjustment out, and may be what Advance was thinking regarding this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5636

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Hi, I fly mine, both PPG and PG on position 2 as well!

I would be interested in how much speed difference you get with the trimmers out.

My gps ground speed only changed a few kph compared to trimmers in. I was a bit disappointed to be honest.

Be careful using both trimmers and speed bar. Higher chance of a frontal.

As T_andrews says both riser and trimmer join together and clip in for Paragliding. It's all a little fatter to slip over the karabiner. For that reason, check and double check the karabiner is properly locked when Paragliding. With both ends locked into the karabiner, the certification is back. With the trimmers out of the karabiner, I believe the wing is un-certified.

Cheers

Mike

:mrgreen:

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