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powerlord

Dudek Nucleon XX ?

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So, after 10 years with my Reaction, I'm thinking of changing - and I like Dudek, so want to stick with them. I like the Nucleon XX - feels like I can get a significantly smaller wing, and get a bit more speed, etc.

I'm 70kg, plus air conception, etc - so reckon on 105-110 all up.

My Reaction is a 29 (95-125kg).

For Nucleon XX looks like a heavy loaded 22 (85-120) or a less loaded 24 (95-130) are the options.

Has anyone here got one, and what's it like ?

what sort of cost are they ?

And what do you reckon my Reaction is worth (good condition, services earlier this year by Aerofix).

stu

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I moved from the ReAction 29 to a Report'Air 24. I like it a lot but it does suffer with the slightly sluggish Dudek inflation characteristic.

I am basing this on the fact that you need a good breeze to reverse launch, same as with the ReAction whereas from what I have read some of the newer wings inflate really easily. I haven't tried any other wings myself.

All up I am around 125kg. My ReAction has 318 hours on it and the value is only what someone is willing to pay for it, which I think is next to nothing as pilots want newer wings with greater speed, for one.

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Hi Stu, I have slightly over 130 hours logged on a Nuc xx 24m. I've owned all generations... i.e. the Nucleon, Nucleon WRC and this XX. It's truly a fantastic wing and pretty much a perfect allrounder (IMHO). FYI I have a smaller snake if I do want a spicier flight, but for XC's, general pottering or sociable flying I'd always reach for the Nuc xx. I'm about 85Kgs and all up weight at about 125-130 so near the top end of my wing range. If I were to buy a new one now I'd definitely go for a 22m but I'm not suffering on the 24m. With your experience level you may still want to look at a 22m.

Like Alan says, it may not launch as readily as a lightened Ozone, but I think that is easily compensated by its top speed and trimmer range. I think bar adds about 12mph (if my memory serves me correctly). In my opinion it also has a nice level of agility mixed with stability. So you can really throw it about... but you're not constantly dampening oscillation in wonky air. I think they're about £2600, but again I'm going from memory here. Chilly is just up the road from you and can probably give you a more accurate/current price.

I've had mine for nearly 3 years now and honestly still love flying it!

I'm over in Cambridgeshire. I think you fly Suffolk area so if you're ever passing, or if you want to come over, you'd be very welcome to take it for a spin!

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Just add some real time info also  , 70kg AC frame EOS 100 , rapp 24 , 2D steering makes it fun round hay bales in any field, but to get any where seems I’ll have to start using bar , which I don’t do , my mates have universals and a nucxx plus a spider also a synthesis 2 I’m all ways back of the bus because it just wants to climb when you get in to the revs , even leaning forward hanging on the A,s . Forgot to say the above is with trims out . 

Edited by cas_whitmore
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12 hours ago, powerlord said:

thanks guys.

report air seems nice too. specs wise they seem pretty much identical ?

https://www.dudek.eu/en/products/reportair.html

https://www.dudek.eu/en/products/nucleon-xx.html

other than the blurb - i'm not really clear on whats different between them tbh.

 

Stu, as far as I understand it they are identical in terms of profile and riser setup etc... but, I thought I was told (when buying), the difference was the number of cells. That said, the website has them both at 60 cells?!?!? However looking at the Rep'Air specs it appears to just have longer lines which I guess would do a similar job - i.e. make it more stable.

I fly with someone on a 22 Rep'Air, and he's a tad lighter than me. As such we're perfectly aligned for speed. We literally trim out and just sit along side one another on XC's.

I've also flown the Rep'Air a few times. They are literally identical to the Nuc xx until you pull brake hard... then it becomes more apparent that the wing is slightly more sedate (only slightly) - e.g. you have to work a bit harder to build up a deep wingover. Other than that there's nothing between them (ignoring colour schemes).

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I've gone from an Ozone Roadster 2 28m to a Nucleon XX 24 and am 85kg and right on 130kg all up, so top end for the Nucleon 24.

The nucleon xx does need more A's to launch than the Ozone and I had to concentrate on forward launches a bit more at first than I did with the Ozone but it doesnt bother me at all now (cira 40 hours on the Nuc). Reverse launches are easy on both but extra 2d lines on brakes add some clutter when on the ground but its worth it in flight. The agility of the Nucleon in flight is on another planet compared to the Roadster. Nucleon has less/no oscillation compared to the Roadster. Landings are a lot faster on the Nuc but once you get used to the ground rush and swoop in and bleed the speed off its great fun and no issue. I havent tried dropping in to a landing slowly on the brakes (like a free flight paraglider) as I dont want to find out I've run out of flare authority! Fast landings give you so much more safety margin with all the flare authority should you need it anyway.

These are my GPS recorded speeds (averaged over several runs in opposite directions) for both wings.

Nucleon XX 24 (130kgAUW)(mph)trim in=26, trim out=32, trim+full bar=40.5

Roadster 2 28 (130kgAUW) (mph) trim in=23.5, out=27.2,trim+fullbar=33.7 

Flying with others I am almost always in front with complaints they cant keep up so Id say your wing loading makes the biggest difference. The speed increase may not seem much on paper but now I can make good progress into 15-20mph headwinds aloft whereas before i felt like I was almost parked. From your weight the 22 looks like a better match according to the Dudek weight charts.

I am really happy with my choice to change and think it was a good good progression for me. It does need more slightly more care/(skills?) when launching and landing but I love learning and improving my skills!

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my worry about a 22 is that it'll take a bunch more throttle to stay level, and I'll climb slower.

I love the ability to climb up and down quick with my reaction/aircon. i'd hate to lose that for the sake of a bit of speed.

also, i average 3litre/hour on aircon/reaction - so I don't want to end up chewing through 5l/hour with a wing the size of a postage stamp.

i suppose i'm a bit unbelieving that a 22m wing will give me the same lift as a 29m wing frankly.

feels like a 24 puts me in about same loading place (about the middle) as my current 29s loading - so though it might be a bit slower, I'd take that for better lift.

cas: I suppose if the report air lines are longer as lee says (good spot - missed that) - then that would explain it climbing more under power ?

Edited by powerlord

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I just had a chat with Clive Bunce (dudek distributor). He reckons report air is the main seller now - less 'wanting to turn' than the nucleon xx - until you want to turn then it's sharp enough. - apparently 'flatter in the middle'.

pity it's not got a cooler name.. sounds like 'dudek mild mannered janitor'... i'd have prefered 'dudek deathmaster 2000' - sounds cooler

anyhoo -  feels like report air is more the wing for me.

I'm not sure I want to part with >3000 squid for a new one though, much as I'd like a wing in custom  st andrews flag colours..

 so if anyone hears of anyone selling a 24 secondhand - do let me know...seeing as I don't go near facebook with a 100 foot long excrement covered stick, I might miss out if someone just posts summit there

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14 hours ago, powerlord said:

pity it's not got a cooler name.. sounds like 'dudek mild mannered janitor'... i'd have prefered 'dudek deathmaster 2000' - sounds cooler

Ha ha... I love this. I totally agree. I also think some of the dudek colour paint schemes are a bit yesterday, but ultimately does that really matter!?!?

You may also find Clive M may have access to a 2nd hand Rep'Air or Nuc xx.

Best of luck whichever way you go.

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Lee, can`t remember if i asked you this during our PM conversation about wings but does the Snake require significantly more power and engine speed to stay level compared to the Nuc?

 

 

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17 hours ago, Hann__ said:

Lee, can`t remember if i asked you this during our PM conversation about wings but does the Snake require significantly more power and engine speed to stay level compared to the Nuc?

TBH I haven't approached this scientifically or even given it a lot of thought, but I don't think there is much in it. If anything I've done some 1-2 hour XC's and, when I've used the Snake, I have definitely found I had more fuel at the conclusion than expected. However please note that I always seem to be burning more fuel than everyone else I fly with, regardless of whether I'm on the Moster Silent or my much newer Moster (or whichever wing). Less pies maybe!!!

That aside, the snake will start oscillating if it sniffs a thermal... or if I pass too close to a butterfly! As such I'll prefer to XC with the Nuc.

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Sorry Hann... I guess I've not directly answered your question there. So no... I don't think it requires more throttle!

I'm sure someone who actually looks properly at such things could prove me wrong though. Invariably I just smile and fly!

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thanks for advice here guys.

I got myself a 2nd hand Report Air (or Deathmaster 2000 as I prefer to call it) Report Air 22 yesterday.

Chilly's old wing for those who know 'im. Very nice custom colours of grey with a hint of green and red on the appropriate wing tips.

Now hoping for an opportunity to fly it before 23/11th when I've signed up with Fly Spain for a week paramotoring in Southern Spain... otherwise I'll be flying the wing for first time there, which is less than ideal and increases the looking a numpty risk considerably...

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Brilliant choice Stu,

The Deathmaster 2000 is a firm favourite with everyone I know flying it.

Coming from Chilly means it will have been well looked after too... I had his old Nuc WRC many moons ago... I loved that wing! Anywho, today looks exceptionally flyable all day long.

Enjoy and fly safe!

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yeh it does. unfortunately I'm working through it.. and now the clocks have changed it's pretty much dark now from end of work day so all I've got is the weekends :-(

 

stu

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I am flying the Deathmaster 2000 24m, had a short flight this afternoon, somewhat bumpy.

Can be a bit fast on landing.

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yeh that's gonna take some getting used to - with 22 being even faster landing... I've never been great at timing my flares, and having dodgy knees (each knee having had 2 ACL ops) - anything at all hard, I chose arse rather than buggering knees up.. 

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out of blue, and against forecasts all week, today was flyable... so got 3 flights in on new wing.

wow.

just wow.

 amazingly easy launches,  popping me into air quicker than reaction.

 

in flight the breaks are so sensitive vs reaction, and on fast trim the TST lines still let you actually TURN - on the reaction you'd pull it right to its stop and then ever so slowly turn that way - here its about same agility as breaks on slow.

and the breaks - pull in toward you just for the tip and a flat turn, etc...wow.

then there's the fact I've never been able to do wingovers. figured it was just my lack of skill - it seemed like fighting the wing all the time.. on this its a Piece of p1ss! -so so easy.

And then... what I was dreading - would landings be super fast... er..no.. the opposite - it bleeds off speed like the reaction doesn't. and still leaves you with a great flare.. just great.

and the other worry - would a tiny 22 give me far less lift, far less climb speed... so I went on to full fast trim, and full speedbar and timed a minute at full power - still climbing... and at 400 ft/min !

very very chuffed. should arguable done this a while back, but glad I did it now.

stu

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