Making Clear Calls in flight. My wireless Sena / Bose / iPhone / GT3 setup

[custom-vince]

Just thought I would share my experiences to date: from Passive helmet headsets, pelter 1,2 & 3, fitting my own speakers to fitting ebay bluetooth bike coms, to full ANR headsets, to adding 101 noise surpressing mic with lighter ANR passive headsets. etc.. through to soldering in my own bluetooth chip into the ANR DNC mic headsets.

 

I come around to what I use today.. Its not perfect in anyway but it does work extremely well. I therefore come to the conclusion that Comms setup is as personal as wing and motor choice. Making something individual to fit your needs.

I currently use a lightweight snowboard helmet with no passive earmuffs. Instead I have Bose QC20 in ear ANR headphones. These are super light, very effective at cancelling noise and allow me to listen to music in flight at lower volumes. These are connected to the Sena 20s bluetooth bike comms, using the sena mic and bluetooth to connect to my iphone. How good is the mic, I answered the phone and the caller refused to believe I was actually flying. They could not hear the engine at all. The Sena mic technology is amazing. Now for radio use I have a GT3 and UV5r, this is connected to a sena sr10i bluetooth adaptor to make the radio into a wireless connection.

The draw backs. Its all a bit fussy. It all needs charging to work. Its expensive.

The good bits. Its super light, fantastic quality. Not sweaty on my head. Quieter than passive ear muffs. The sena can talk to other bluetooth headsets and open comms to your mate is great, just chat while flying, no ptt radio. I also have an optional gopro backpack to use my mic sound rather than the gopro onboard mic. Allows voice over recording but stops my iPhone music. 

Why do I want to make calls while flying? In the past I have called ahead a local farm airfield and asked for permission to land, while in flight. I have also called a mate and landed near where he was working. It has its benefits.

Im not recommending this system as such. Its an expansive setup and to fussy to recommend. Wheres the future. Im liking the simplistic look of the Sena Tufftalk http://www.sena.com/product/tufftalk/

 

How good is it for our purpose. I don't know yet, but to me it looks promising. Lacking a few features of the feature rich 20S multi audio handling which is a good feature. Plus the bike com is designed to handle engine and wind noise. Maybe the tuff talk is different.

 

links to current kit:

Sena SR10 http://www.sena.com/product/sr10/

Sena 20s http://www.sena.com/product/20s/

Bose QC20i (i for iPhone version) https://www.bose.co.uk/en_gb/products/headphones/earphones/quietcomfort-20i-acoustic-noise-cancelling-headphones.html

 

both the above have been superceeded with newer models. 

[nforster]

quick question vince- i have the microavionics pm100 but i am looking for a lightweight set up- just bluetooth to play iphone in flight- i use the pm100 for this and i like the volume function on the ear cup. any idea re diy/ bluetooth module that i could hack?

 

[custom-vince]

Yes, there is such things for £10 on ebay.

 

[custom-vince]

something like this. I have used in the past. I cant find my exact one.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Wireless-3-0-Bluetooth-Audio-Receiver-Stereo-Music-Car-Adapter-Mic-3-5mm-AUX-/301117099344?hash=item461bfa4d50:g:WM4AAOSwDV1XQxF-

or this.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Bluetooth-Transmitter-Box-3-5mm-Audio-Stereo-Reciever-Transceiver-2in1-Adapter-/162030209079?hash=item25b9c0c837:g:hh4AAOSwo4pYNZ7P

Just type "Bluetooth Audio" into ebay, there is a wide choice. Make sure it receives and fits your plug type.

 

[custom-vince]

Also you can search for wireless headphone adaptor. I have tried and used both successfully. ignore the built in mic as that will not handle our high noise environment. The bonus to headphone adaptors is they often have volume buttons.

[custom-vince]

This is still my current preferred setup. Personally, not for everyone.

Paramotor helmet ear defenders by Surfer Vince, on Flickr

I have snowboard helmet, bose qc20, sent 20s, gopro session5.

What I like. Its the quietest noise elimination I can find which also boasts good sound. I like music while flying and actually find myself turning this one down. I like the fact there are no wires between body and head. The Sena is super clear, forget m101 pics, the electronics in the sena have me trying to convince people I am flying, they cannot hear the engine. I once switched to FaceTime to prove it.

What I dislike. Its a bit messy, the Bose QC20 battery is cable tied to the from of the helmet just above my brow. If its not charged then they are poor ear plugs, it relies heavily on the excellent base anr. It picks up some wind noise on the headphones, which is why I use a ski snow helmet with fluffy sides to reduce this. Still quieter than muffs. The sena to send comms is great if your mate also has a sena. If you want to connect radio then you buy another box to make the radio wireless.

[AndySV1K]

Hi Vince,

I'm just starting the same process of sorting a helmet out.  I have various ideas and much were along similar ideas to yours by chance.

I actually already have the same bose headphones as you, quick question on those, do you suffer any popping or clipping with them?  When i've used mine in such situations as on the tube, loud noises like the doors closing make the headphones clip as they can't cope with the noise level.  it's quite distracting.   i wondered whether paramotoring would be better with it being a more constant noise level?

I've got some ear defenders on order to play around with and may end up with the sena setup eventually too.

Great idea on the ski helmet as there's loads out there available.  Paramotor specific helmets are so pricey for what they are, I'm guessing it's a small market for them so they are bound to be.

I'm also hoping to experiment with a smart cycle helmet that my company sells, It might prove difficult to mount the ear defenders on it, but if it works then it's got built in bluetooth and a hd video camera.

 

Andy.

 

[Guest chrisg547]

22 hours ago, custom-vince said:

This is still my current preferred setup. Personally, not for everyone.

Paramotor helmet ear defenders by Surfer Vince, on Flickr

I have snowboard helmet, bose qc20, sent 20s, gopro session5.

What I like. Its the quietest noise elimination I can find which also boasts good sound. I like music while flying and actually find myself turning this one down. I like the fact there are no wires between body and head. The Sena is super clear, forget m101 pics, the electronics in the sena have me trying to convince people I am flying, they cannot hear the engine. I once switched to FaceTime to prove it.

What I dislike. Its a bit messy, the Bose QC20 battery is cable tied to the from of the helmet just above my brow. If its not charged then they are poor ear plugs, it relies heavily on the excellent base anr. It picks up some wind noise on the headphones, which is why I use a ski snow helmet with fluffy sides to reduce this. Still quieter than muffs. The sena to send comms is great if your mate also has a sena. If you want to connect radio then you buy another box to make the radio wireless.

 

 

Ive just had the Sena 30K delivered and am going to make a headset set up with them.

We actually talked about using Bose QC20 as extra hearing protection. I actually fly with ear plugs in, under my PM100's ( I have a bit of tinnitus ).

I was thinking of having them under a set of Peltors for a belt and braces approach. Although Im not sure the pain of making sure everything is charged up is worth the extra cost.

Im surprised that that is all you use Vince. Are they really that good?

[custom-vince]

Yes I find they are really that good. I don't think you would wear them under ear defenders successfully as they poke out a little bit and need to be fitted just right, the defenders would push on the wire and possibly pop the pods out of your ear with the leverage.

If you have tinnitus, just try some anr at a shop. No need for music, turn it on and feel the silence. If you have a Bose shop near you, they will have demo sets in store.

 

From my own testing. Unbranded ear defenders, peltor optime2 then peltor optime3 then peltor1 to my chinese anr sets, these were the quietest of the bunch, easily surpassing the pelters, my friends plane had £1200 Bose head units, so I started trying different ANR headphones and mostly they were so so, the bose do a great job. Learning how the ANR worked and a little about acoustic chambers, i.e. the cup that is part of peltor, over head headphones etc, that is where the last of the noise was coming from, as much as it reduced pitch noises like engine and exhaust the air thump of the prop was the one that I would still suffer from. Came to the idea that ANR in ear pods would be great as the anr is working just on the ear canal only, a tiny space with very little to no echo. It worked and worked well, what noise comes through the bose cancels very effectively. They are not a perfect seal plus your head itself is quite a cavity for noise.

A simple test I devised:

Humm to your self, a low continuous hum from the throat. Now put your hand over your ears, the humm gets louder.. This is ear defenders. Try again but this time put your fingers in your ears, this is what good ANR sounds like.

A demo I used to do with the Chinese ANR headset was to humm, and the switch it on. It went from cupped echo to fingers in ears feeling. Its just like someone moved the noise to another room and shut the door.. its there but its quieter.

 

What could be improved? If bose made metal backed earplug style headphones with ANR, that would be a bit a of both and perfect.

[custom-vince]

Good review here: says an average noise reduction of 25-30dB

 

https://thewirecutter.com/reviews/best-noise-cancelling-in-ear-headphones/

 

 

Edited October 13, 2017 by custom-vince

[Guest chrisg547]

4 hours ago, custom-vince said:

Yes I find they are really that good. I don't think you would wear them under ear defenders successfully as they poke out a little bit and need to be fitted just right, the defenders would push on the wire and possibly pop the pods out of your ear with the leverage.

If you have tinnitus, just try some anr at a shop. No need for music, turn it on and feel the silence. If you have a Bose shop near you, they will have demo sets in store.

 

From my own testing. Unbranded ear defenders, peltor optime2 then peltor optime3 then peltor1 to my chinese anr sets, these were the quietest of the bunch, easily surpassing the pelters, my friends plane had £1200 Bose head units, so I started trying different ANR headphones and mostly they were so so, the bose do a great job. Learning how the ANR worked and a little about acoustic chambers, i.e. the cup that is part of peltor, over head headphones etc, that is where the last of the noise was coming from, as much as it reduced pitch noises like engine and exhaust the air thump of the prop was the one that I would still suffer from. Came to the idea that ANR in ear pods would be great as the anr is working just on the ear canal only, a tiny space with very little to no echo. It worked and worked well, what noise comes through the bose cancels very effectively. They are not a perfect seal plus your head itself is quite a cavity for noise.

A simple test I devised:

Humm to your self, a low continuous hum from the throat. Now put your hand over your ears, the humm gets louder.. This is ear defenders. Try again but this time put your fingers in your ears, this is what good ANR sounds like.

A demo I used to do with the Chinese ANR headset was to humm, and the switch it on. It went from cupped echo to fingers in ears feeling. Its just like someone moved the noise to another room and shut the door.. its there but its quieter.

 

What could be improved? If bose made metal backed earplug style headphones with ANR, that would be a bit a of both and perfect.

Thanks for such an in depth reply. Im amazed that they work so well with no other ear protection. I guess that's what the price of the Bose get you.

I may tinker with the 30K in some Peltor 3's that i have lying around and still use my rubber ear plugs as i find that get rid of the direct to ear noise of the speakers (maybe as you said its like putting your fingers in your ears). With then 30K and Bose it will certainly be a very expensive set up. Also a pain to remember to charge everything. Im bad enough at remembering to charge my radio once in a while. Also am looking forward to seeing how it all works in group flying ie. Will it do exactly as they advertise?

[Guest chrisg547]

On 13/10/2017 at 10:59, custom-vince said:

Yes I find they are really that good. I don't think you would wear them under ear defenders successfully as they poke out a little bit and need to be fitted just right, the defenders would push on the wire and possibly pop the pods out of your ear with the leverage.

If you have tinnitus, just try some anr at a shop. No need for music, turn it on and feel the silence. If you have a Bose shop near you, they will have demo sets in store.

 

From my own testing. Unbranded ear defenders, peltor optime2 then peltor optime3 then peltor1 to my chinese anr sets, these were the quietest of the bunch, easily surpassing the pelters, my friends plane had £1200 Bose head units, so I started trying different ANR headphones and mostly they were so so, the bose do a great job. Learning how the ANR worked and a little about acoustic chambers, i.e. the cup that is part of peltor, over head headphones etc, that is where the last of the noise was coming from, as much as it reduced pitch noises like engine and exhaust the air thump of the prop was the one that I would still suffer from. Came to the idea that ANR in ear pods would be great as the anr is working just on the ear canal only, a tiny space with very little to no echo. It worked and worked well, what noise comes through the bose cancels very effectively. They are not a perfect seal plus your head itself is quite a cavity for noise.

A simple test I devised:

Humm to your self, a low continuous hum from the throat. Now put your hand over your ears, the humm gets louder.. This is ear defenders. Try again but this time put your fingers in your ears, this is what good ANR sounds like.

A demo I used to do with the Chinese ANR headset was to humm, and the switch it on. It went from cupped echo to fingers in ears feeling. Its just like someone moved the noise to another room and shut the door.. its there but its quieter.

 

What could be improved? If bose made metal backed earplug style headphones with ANR, that would be a bit a of both and perfect.

Sorry Vince, but I'm a bit confused as in which order you think the peltors are best. Can you elaborate?

[custom-vince]

In my experience there was not much to choose between them in the ppg environment. I would be tempted with optime2. the 1 is very shallow and harder to get speakers in. The 3's are really deep and stick out a bit. 2 is the mid / standard size and works much the same but has a little more room to push speakers in. 

I have a little experience with acoustic environments. I know certain panels use a fibre wool. DIY studio will use sponge. I wonder if we can improve peltors. I know they should know what they are doing but its at a price and at manufacturing speed. Im thinking, rubber coating, fibre wool, 2 types of foam. Theres room to improve it.